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Thread: UK PRS vultures want your stream money.

  1. #1
    BanHammer™ Manu's Avatar
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    UK PRS vultures want your stream money.

    PRS: Performing Rights Society

    So, if you live in the UK, and you want to perform live to an audience streaming, the PRS wants you to pay them a fee...

    https://www.theguardian.com/music/20...treamed-events


    In December, the PRS proposed a tariff of between 8% and 17% gross revenues for live-streamed events, a marked increase on its usual 4.2% gross takings from in-person gigs. This would be retrospectively applied to live streams that took place earlier in the year. An open letter from the Featured Artists Coalition (FAC) and the Music Managers Forum (MMF), its signatories including representatives for Lipa, Liam Gallagher and Arctic Monkeys, urged them to reconsider.

    The PRS has now implemented those tariffs and announced a new flat fee for live-streamed shows that generate less than £500 gross. Event organisers of shows taking up to £250 will pay the PRS £22.50 plus VAT, regardless of whether takings surpass that figure. The fee doubles for shows grossing between £251 and £500.

    [...]

    A PRS spokesperson said it was not “seeking to prevent artists, many of whom are PRS members, from generating an income from online concerts”, but to ensure that non-performing members such as songwriters and composers “can share in the value being generated by online live concerts which are using their works”
    So if you live in the UK, perform for a living and trying to make a little revenue during covid, the PRS guy wants a chunk of it

    Flat fee + up to 17% of profit + VAT (that's 20% tax on top)

    As if the situation wasn't absolute worse at the moment already. This sets a dangerous precedent imho, and the PRS are notorious for previous other situations where they were described as money grabbing bullies.

    About 10 years ago they tried that exact very same little stunt on Youtube. As it panned out, Youtube was utterly and completely unfazed, they simply muted the UK sound for a week, and the whole of the UK asked what the hell is going on. The PRS came back on their knees begging to have the sound back on, said sorry and dropped all monetary demands. So now instead of going for the google/youtube behemoth, they go after the artist.


    In response to the PRS’s announcement, the Mill in Bradford has cancelled its remaining IVW shows, which were due to raise money for charity.

    [...]

    “We’ve had crew working for free to support musicians, or artists working for free to support venues. There’s been huge moral support and people rallying to help each other. They’re doing it to stay alive and the rug’s been pulled out from under that.”

    Last edited by Manu; 01-28-2021 at 03:55 AM.
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  2. #2
    Moderator Mark_Spit's Avatar
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    Wow. That's really scummy, especially given the current global situation with covid.

    That being said, I can totally see a similar model coming to Canada.
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  3. #3
    Moderator pete's Avatar
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    They got some crazy-talk style rules like "themusiclicence".
    Basically if someone is listening to music at work (or anthing other than a "domestic environment), on any type of device, then the company has to pay over 27p per day to PRS.
    (So I literally think that means every single business in the world)

    This PRS, I'm guessing they get salaries. Pretty tidy ones too, cos they wear nice suits.

    I've worked the numbers for a fair few musicians in my day on the mechanicals side (funnily enough even some that are moaning about that PRS streaming thing), and they make diddly from their music. Far from anything you'd consider a salary. It's all swallowed up by labels and lawyers and contracts and suits. Like the PRS.

    The bitter irony.
    Last edited by pete; 02-01-2021 at 12:18 PM.
    bored, curious, deaf or just bad taste in music?
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    and what's this, another shoddy mix...another dull mix

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by pete View Post
    I've worked the numbers for a fair few musicians in my day on the mechanicals side (funnily enough even some that are moaning about that PRS streaming thing), and they make diddly from their music. Far from anything you'd consider a salary. It's all swallowed up by labels and lawyers and contracts and suits. Like the PRS.

    The bitter irony.
    I remember a country (Canada?) trying to sue the major labels (like Sony) for transferring whole albums onto CDs without paying the owners of the songs anything. Basically, most of the AAD CDs sold in the 1990s were pirated copies.
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    New Member djkippax's Avatar
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    I ran a little eCommerce store from home many years back. Anyway, the project failed but two years later I had these PRS bozos phone me up and demand I start paying a music licence for my premises. I told them the business was now defunct and I'd closed it down two years earlier. They were going to send someone round to check, that's until they realised the business address was a residential address. They were awful to deal with on the phone. The rep who called me was a really snobby and arrogant piece of work.
    They have and always will be a bunch of rent-seeking a*seholes.
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  6. #6
    BanHammer™ Manu's Avatar
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    ^^^^^^ HAHAHAHAHAHA

    Trying to charge a PRS licence on a private residence? Should have told them to shut up and dared them before hanging up, then they would have sent a jobsworth at your place. That would have been worth a good laugh.

    Most notorious story was the PRS trying to charge a garage, arguing they could hear the customer's car radio while in the building...

    I have a friend who runs a shop, and the PRS were on his case constantly because he sells Hifi and radios etc. He told them they were more than welcome to come to his shop and record evidence of him playing music in a public access area, then he would pay the licence on the basis of them proving him being due
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  7. #7
    Moderator pete's Avatar
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    Had PRS types call one day saying the hold music on the phone system needed a licence because it was music.

    Had to explain it was the company owner's personal "anthem" written by him about how great he was. They shuffled off.
    bored, curious, deaf or just bad taste in music?
    finally a mix by me
    and what's this, another shoddy mix...another dull mix

  8. #8
    Deez Beats! KLH's Avatar
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    I don't know how they did it, but the PRS sounds actually worse than the RIAA.
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  9. #9
    BanHammer™ Manu's Avatar
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    Same vultures different countries, to be fair.
    SoundCloud ______ MixCloud
    "Wrong speed, we've got it on the wrong speed. For those of you who are recovering from a hangover, that's gonna sound just right. " - Robin Williams

  10. #10
    New Member djkippax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manu View Post
    Most notorious story was the PRS trying to charge a garage, arguing they could hear the customer's car radio while in the building...
    Think I remember that story being in the papers. Was it around 2008ish?
    The battleline between good and evil runs through the heart of every man. - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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