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Thread: Harmonic mixing in trance

  1. #11
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    I have Mixed In Key and I tried doing the whole harmonic thing for a while, but I found that it was too limiting in terms of when I can play what. I prefer to know the structure of the tracks I'm playing and mix them in a way where noticeable key clashing is minimal.

    In my opinion, the overall feeling and flow of a mix is far more important than each track being in a similar key. Here's a mix I made recently:
    http://www.geoffledak.com/music/Geof...%20Thought.mp3

    Transitions are at: 6:30, 12:20, 17:35, 23:46, 31:00, 36:34, 43:45 (tracks are in same key), 49:42, 54:43 (tracks are in same key), 62:27
    Last edited by ChEeZeBaLL; 06-12-2014 at 02:52 PM.

  2. #12
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    I am totally fond of using this system in order to generate more "flow" within my sets, I am however a newcomer to the art of mixing but learned a great deal over the past month or so. I've made a mix with the idea to use the Camelot system throughout, maybe you could gain something from checking it out.
    PS: Its progressive psy
    https://soundcloud.com/peroy-nel/excessive-progressive

  3. #13
    Member mr_ragz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackStalk View Post
    This is definitely a good guide to get started, but once you become proficient mixing in key you can break the rules when you learn your tracks well. I regularly jump three semitones (example: 1A->4A) and it sounds perfect. It's very relative to the tracks youre mixing, but a good chart to learn the basics of harmonic mixing.
    I would really like to know more of these little tricks. I can remember 1A>4A (I'm assuming 4A>1A works as well?) Any other good ones?
    Quote Originally Posted by KLH View Post
    Welcome back, Ragz. You are always welcome here.
    Guys, this is the legend. Recognize the greatness.

  4. #14
    Member ChrisHynds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr_ragz View Post
    I would really like to know more of these little tricks. I can remember 1A>4A (I'm assuming 4A>1A works as well?) Any other good ones?
    use your ears, best trick in the book
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  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by mr_ragz View Post
    I would really like to know more of these little tricks. I can remember 1A>4A (I'm assuming 4A>1A works as well?) Any other good ones?
    4a-11a works, I'd say 4a-1a usually brings down the energy of the room. I mostly only mix forwards unless it's a mashup between two comparative keys (8A->1A) or a single semitone drop (4a->3a)

  6. #16
    Member mr_ragz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisHynds View Post
    use your ears, best trick in the book
    Keep your troll city comments to yourself

    Quote Originally Posted by JackStalk View Post
    4a-11a works, I'd say 4a-1a usually brings down the energy of the room. I mostly only mix forwards unless it's a mashup between two comparative keys (8A->1A) or a single semitone drop (4a->3a)
    Mixing forward eh? Hmmmm, I guess I never really paid attention to mixing forward or backwards. Good little tip, unfortunately I can't rep you again yet lol
    Quote Originally Posted by KLH View Post
    Welcome back, Ragz. You are always welcome here.
    Guys, this is the legend. Recognize the greatness.

  7. #17
    As a rough guide I tend to find that the keys 3 apart work well together so 3, 6, 9 and 12 work together; 1, 4, 7 and 10 work, and 2, 5, 8 and 11 work.
    Keys exactly 3 apart and with a different tonality work especially well so 3a and 6b will generally work very well. These wont work as well as mixing numbers next to each other but it does mean that you have a much wider range of tracks you can play while being vaguely harmonically coherent.

  8. #18
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    it is a good practice to NOT go over +2 or -2. It thins out the kick in the song. Also, songs that have vocals do not sound good if you change the key to the positive side ( + ) because it sounds like the person is on helium. It sounds fine, when the vocal is -1, or -2. Mixed in key is a very accurate program, but the thing is that if you are using Traktor Pro, these guys have invented their own key for their program. So you would have to decipher the keys with the Camelot system.

    So you know about harmonic mixing. Example: Current Song is 5A (Key is at 0). The incoming song would sound perfect with it being 5A. If you want to increase the "energy," mixing it to 6A would work also. In conclusion, the incoming song would have a smooth transition if it was either 5A, 4A, 6A, or even 5B, and even 6B and 4B.

    Another trick to mixing is changing the key. Great DJ's can change the key by ear, but I cannot do this by ear yet. Changing keys is a neat trick that you can do to a song. Remember, the general rule is withing +2 or -2. Example: Song 1 is in F# Minor (11A). If you want it to play in F you would change it 1 semitone, which would be -1. If you want it to play in G, you would add +1 to the key. If you want song 1 to play G#/Ab, you would increase the key +2. Example 1: So now if you had a song (song 1 with key at 0) playing in 10B (DMajor) , a good incoming track would be either 8B, 3B, 5B, or 12B. If you decided to mix song 2 that was in 5B into song 1, you would change the key on song 2 to -1. Example 2: another example is if you had song 1 with an Original key of 3A Bb-minor with a key change of -2; song 1 is now currently at 1A or G#/Ab. So if you wanted to incorporate the camelot system, you can mix song 2 into song 1 that has a key of 12A, 1A, 2A, 1B, 12B, 2B--keeping in mind that song 2's key is at 0.

    Complicated yet? I have attached a picture for you to use to help you see what I'm talking about

    Here is an example of what it all sounds like. Please excuse me because this is my first mix as a bedroom DJ.
    http://www.mixcloud.com/mosesalexand...nceton-square/
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #19
    I have been doing this by ear for years now.. sometimes (not always) going through several tracks in headphones if I need to.. to find one that works well. But this past weekend I tried for the first time to use MIK and to select tracks "by the numbers".. and yea, in some ways it helped, in some ways it actually just messed me up because mixes that, by the numbers, should have been in compatible keys, didn't sound right.. yet others that were in less ideal keys worked out fine.

    So yea.. I struggled with it a little bit. I'd say in some ways it made my mixing better, in some ways worse.

    But I think it's a valuable tool to have around.. I'm putting the camelot #'s in the track titles now so I can glance at them and take a hint from them while still going by ear.. so that eventually I'll be both checking that, and checking them by ear.. without feeling like MIK is actually slowing me down...

  10. #20
    Here's some simple rules to follow, abbreviated to avoid wall of text status.

    1. Mixing in key is great. Follow it as a general rule, but remember; if you feel like a song is going to mix in well, you're probably right. Let your intuition guide you. The rules can be broken.

    2. Don't follow charts. Don't follow the trance "top 10." It's all terrible. Dig. Check out J00F and Airwave's labels.

    3. Don't get stuck on playing only new tunes. If you have a track from 2009 that you love that fits in, play it. People don't hear this shit often; nothing is going to sound old or outdated.
    DJF Trance Champion 2012
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