So the promoter says...

[bmorr]

on Saturday "hey man i've got a gig for you next Saturday at PLAY nightclub, it'll be an opening set." I was like yea sure i'll do it, but let me know the compensation beforehand so there's no surprises the day of.

Next thing I know he asks me for my information and logo n shit, so I send it to him.

Today (5 days later) he sends me the event invite on FB, gets my name wrong on the poster and phones me saying he found out what my pay is going to be. SO i was like ok what is it? he says "the pay is going to be $100 to open and it's contingent on you bringing 25 ppl out to the event." So I say, no I'm not going to do it if my $100 is contingent on bringing 25ppl out to this 400capacity club when there are a total of 4 DJs and I'm just opening. Not to mention it's Halloween Saturday, what kind of promoters do you have if you need me to guarantee 25 people on a night like that?

I was like I can make over $150 just promoting and getting 25 people out, this is ridiculous. I'm a DJ not a promoter, I haven't promoted in over 4 years, you never said I would be required to promote. Anyway I told him thank you for thinking of me but that I just don't do that and it wasn't a right fit for me.

amirite?

[cognac]

youre rite....thats promoters job, alot of "promoters" seem to be passing the buck onto djs. they can suck it

[Mahatma Coat]

thats promoters job, alot of "promoters" seem to be passing the buck onto djs. they can suck it

Sorry dude, but I'm pretty sure that's not how it works, at least where I'm from. As a DJ you also promote, that's how it goes. Now the idea that you have to get X amount of people into the club before you get paid, that's slightly different, but still this guy is asking for you to bring along 25 heads into the building, surely that's not beyond your capabilities?

If the guy was saying you need 100 people in the door before you get paid, then I would say 'suck it' indeed. However, I've been hanging out with DJs and promoters for the past ten years and in all my experience the DJs always promote their own nights/the nights they play at, at least to a certain extent. Even if you're not in control of the artistic side of things, logos etc. then you still promote the club owner/promoter's flyers/posters/ go along to events and network the night etc.

It just goes with the territory. The other angle of this is, if you don't do it, someone else sure as hell will. Whether you like it or not, this is the situation. DJs generally also function as promoters, its a blurred line and one you have to accept and work with if you want to get gigs.

Again I say, if your pay is contingent on how many people you bring along, then that's slightly different, but as far as general promotion goes, its something you need to be doing to get the work in the first place.

[tuurrtles]

How long is your opening set? In other words, how much are you getting paid per hour?

As far as I'm learning here on this board, promotions is part of the game. It actually seems like a fun part of it too, you can get creative with it. But maybe that's just me.

What I want to know is, how are they going to know that 25 people are there to see you specifically? Are they using the facebook event thing to see how many people you can get to say "Yes"?

[bmorr]

Sorry dude, but I'm pretty sure that's not how it works, at least where I'm from. As a DJ you also promote, that's how it goes. Now the idea that you have to get X amount of people into the club before you get paid, that's slightly different, but still this guy is asking for you to bring along 25 heads into the building, surely that's not beyond your capabilities?

If the guy was saying you need 100 people in the door before you get paid, then I would say 'suck it' indeed. However, I've been hanging out with DJs and promoters for the past ten years and in all my experience the DJs always promote their own nights/the nights they play at, at least to a certain extent. Even if you're not in control of the artistic side of things, logos etc. then you still promote the club owner/promoter's flyers/posters/ go along to events and network the night etc.

It just goes with the territory. The other angle of this is, if you don't do it, someone else sure as hell will. Whether you like it or not, this is the situation. DJs generally also function as promoters, its a blurred line and one you have to accept and work with if you want to get gigs.

Again I say, if your pay is contingent on how many people you bring along, then that's slightly different, but as far as general promotion goes, its something you need to be doing to get the work in the first place.

How long is your opening set? In other words, how much are you getting paid per hour?

As far as I'm learning here on this board, promotions is part of the game. It actually seems like a fun part of it too, you can get creative with it. But maybe that's just me.

What I want to know is, how are they going to know that 25 people are there to see you specifically? Are they using the facebook event thing to see how many people you can get to say "Yes"?

I don't mean to come off the wrong way guys, but I've been DJing for over 6 years now and I haven't promoted once since my all-ages days in high school. At least over here in Toronto events hire the DJs just to DJ and the promoters are tasked with bringing people in. And if you do want the DJ to promote you tell them right off the bat, NOT with 3 days left before the event and then make their pay contingent on bringing a certain amount of people. I'm sorry if you feel like this is normal, but while many scumbag promoters and low-end club managers may have you think it is, it certainly is not. The DJ's job isn't to provide a crowd for the other peak DJs, their job is to ensure the patrons of the club enjoy their time, and in my case, build the energy up for the peak DJ. Opening is A LOT less fun, and much harder than doing a peak set. And while yes I may be able to bring 25 people, for those types of numbers AND for DJing the pay should at least be $200, even if only for an hour. The promoter never told me what the cover fee was, nor who else was bringing people in. He knew right off the bat that I wasn't a promoter. The hardest part about running a DJ event is actually getting people through the doors, these types of promoters just go and get different DJs each event to lower their overhead and make the DJs do the promoting instead of having to pay real promoters.

Not to mention, I've been in the game for a while now, and realistically once you've been DJing for over a year or two your friends have already come and seen you, it's not quite as easy to bring a huge group of friends after a while, as it was when you first start (I know I used to bring out over 200 ppl to my events), especially in 3 days when everyone most likely has already made plans for their Halloween weekend. Ask any DJ who's been around for a few years in a decent club scene.

@Mahatma Coat: YEa I promote all the time, I send out the invites put up posters and get people to come out, but I get paid a set fee regardless. If I could pull large numbers and want to get paid based on how many people come through, Why would I want to spin for this person if I could be doing the same thing and running my own night and be getting paid better? It's not that hard to book out a decent club on a good night.

[cognac]

Sorry dude, but I'm pretty sure that's not how it works, at least where I'm from. As a DJ you also promote, that's how it goes. Now the idea that you have to get X amount of people into the club before you get paid, that's slightly different, but still this guy is asking for you to bring along 25 heads into the building, surely that's not beyond your capabilities?

If the guy was saying you need 100 people in the door before you get paid, then I would say 'suck it' indeed. However, I've been hanging out with DJs and promoters for the past ten years and in all my experience the DJs always promote their own nights/the nights they play at, at least to a certain extent. Even if you're not in control of the artistic side of things, logos etc. then you still promote the club owner/promoter's flyers/posters/ go along to events and network the night etc.

It just goes with the territory. The other angle of this is, if you don't do it, someone else sure as hell will. Whether you like it or not, this is the situation. DJs generally also function as promoters, its a blurred line and one you have to accept and work with if you want to get gigs.

Again I say, if your pay is contingent on how many people you bring along, then that's slightly different, but as far as general promotion goes, its something you need to be doing to get the work in the first place.

Im sorry.....but that is promoters job.....it is thier job to "promote" and our job to dj.....who gets the percentage of the 25 people? the promoter thats who

[Shishdisma]

Im sorry.....but that is promoters job.....it is thier job to "promote" and our job to dj.....who gets the percentage of the 25 people? the promoter thats who

Oh look, its "the guest DJ." If you're an affiliate of the club, you promote for the club. If youre going to act like a prick and not contribute to the event, goodbye, they have friends who can fill your spot easily.

On topic, if you're looking to establish a relationship with the promoters and the club, consider that condition a test, not as just stiffing you. If you get in the door on shitty terms, you're still in the door, get into the club's circle, and you've got a future there. If youre just looking to collect a cheque and bounce, the promotion staff is going to treat you as such.

[JuxtaPoser]

How would they quantify how many people you had brought to the club?

It's a douchebag move from the promoter. Sure, as a promoter you want DJs who will bring out a crowd - obviously. However, you can't hedge your bets by only paying someone IF they do that, you need to book someone you think WILL bring a crowd and hope they do. If they dont, then oh well, book someone else next time.

In short, it's not unreasonable for a promoter to expect a DJ to help promote an event (it's in both parties' interests), however it's outrageous to make the DJ's pay contingent on that...

[Shishdisma]

How would they quantify how many people you had brought to the club?

It's a douchebag move from the promoter. Sure, as a promoter you want DJs who will bring out a crowd - obviously. However, you can't hedge your bets by only paying someone IF they do that, you need to book someone you think WILL bring a crowd and hope they do. If they dont, then oh well, book someone else next time.

In short, it's not unreasonable for a promoter to expect a DJ to help promote an event (it's in both parties' interests), however it's outrageous to make the DJ's pay contingent on that...

If you really think about it, there's no way to actually determine if he brought in "25 people" or not, so the contingency was probably actually "don't be a selfish prick who contributes nothing to the event, drinks everything, trashes the decks, and then stretches your hand out at the end of the night."

[JuxtaPoser]

If you really think about it, there's no way to actually determine if he brought in "25 people" or not, so the contingency was probably actually "don't be a selfish prick who contributes nothing to the event, drinks everything, trashes the decks, and then stretches your hand out at the end of the night."

I agree, that is a very reasonable expectation from a promoter. The issue lies in the way he (apparently) insisted on linking the pay to a vaguely defined and hard to measure expectation for the DJ to bring people out. It seems like this whole thing could have been avoided by better communication between the two parties.

If someone had offered me this gig with those terms, I'd have asked how they intended to measure who I'd brought to the club before going on to say that I'd do my best to promote the event for them but I didn't see how it could be quantified or reasonably be expected to justify my payment.

All too often on these forums I see threads casting promoters as some kind of evil arch-enemies of all DJs. The fact is they're actually our bosses, and unless you fancy a career spent playing Top 40 in a lounge bar you need to wake up and start working WITH them. Obviously there's some dickheads as there are in any industry, but there's plenty of good people out there.