Criticism Vs. Hating - something that is contributing to messing up the DJ scene

**Sigma** · 08-25-2012, 07:24 PM

This is something that I think needs to be addressed. Post your thoughts!

There is a difference between criticism and hating, although the line between the two can become blurred. To me, criticism is generally always good. Hating is generally always bad.

An example of criticism - If you don't learn to mix without auto-sync, you are limited in what equipment you can use and you may miss out on what can be a rewarding part of DJing.
An example of hating - Auto-sync is wack! You're a joke! Buy and use the gear I'm telling you to buy and use or you're pathetic.

Another example of criticism - Your mix wasn't very good, so I would advise that you learn the basics of phrase matching and using levels and EQs properly.
Another example of hating - Your mix is shit! Sell your gear and forget being a DJ!

The other difference between criticism and hating other than the way that the criticism is portrayed is in who/what the criticism is aimed at. Those that want to help people via criticism offer it up as a way to nudge a person in the right direction. Someone that's hating will hate even if the person they're hating on is better than they are, because it's not coming from a logical and honest standpoint. They may be jealous. They may just be trolling idiots.

Criticism is helpful to everyone IMO, as long as it's presented in a somewhat constructive manner. Hating doesn't really achieve anything positive, and my problem with it is that it can create a divide between experienced DJs that have potentially good advice to give, but are somewhat set in their ways, and n00b DJs that are just coming up that would benefit from some guidance. That can lead to those n00bs seeing people with lots of experience as "dinosaurs" that are stuck in the past and then both parties shut up shop and nobody benefits.

I guess what I'm saying is - don't judge a book by its cover. Not everybody DJs the same way that you do. Judge a person by their passion, their knowledge, their professionalism, their mixes, whether they are successfully rocking parties, and whether they sound like they respect the artform of DJing. If you see a n00b going down a road that you feel is the wrong one, say so, but explain yourself. If you're an experienced DJ, think about your own prejudices and whether or not they actually make any sense in 2012. Think whether the advice you are giving is actual good, critical advice, or whether it crosses over into hating, because if you do the latter you are only pushing people away!

That's not to say that hating is never justified, but a lot of venom that's directed at n00b DJs is totally undeserved and is actually counter-productive.

**dlove** · 08-26-2012, 05:09 AM

yep; 'hating' is putting somebody/thing down because you're jealous they're doing it; jealous of their enthusiasm. ('you're' being generic, not specific).
A good critic is one who joins in with their enthusiasm and enjoys feeling it. Criticising can verge onto hating when they're not doing it the way you think it should be done, and have no enthusiasm for what they're doing - like, using 'newfangled' equipment or playing music you don't like.
Being on the scene for so many years, I've checked myself many times (to make sure I'm not hating for hating's sake/being jealous), and noticed a lot of haters myself.

**Manu** · 08-26-2012, 05:33 AM

I'm wondering where the thin line is when it's actually about someone who genuinely can't mix instant coffee and sugar. I have seen a few who are a living testimony which proves that money does not buy skills, or an actual taste for music. In that aspect I also have lost count of mixes tracklists that are more or less the beatport top ten of the moment.

On the other hand I have seen a few with no budget but eager to learn and get better at it.

**djlukewathey** · 08-26-2012, 05:44 AM

couldnt agree more with this

when i was learning and seeking online help i got alot of great advice and guidance but unfortunatly there was a few stupid replys which didnt help me in anyway,

at the end of the day were all here to do the same thing play music

**DJ Elroy** · 08-26-2012, 10:25 AM

Just for the sake of argument, I think sometimes the only way to thin the over-populated herd of the DJ pool is a little hard talk. Is it hating if it's true? Sure, there are people that will talk trash because they're jealous, but if a DJ is so arrogant and delusional that he thinks his stuff don't stink and attacks people that are leaving constructive criticism, then it may be time to step it up and call him out. "Hating" could be any nonconstructive feedback, but I'd say sometimes it may be socially acceptable (and necessary). A certain "2001 Mix" comes to mind.

Hating may never be the best (or from one musician to another, the most professional) answer, but sometimes it is well-deserved on the part of the artist. Times like these are the exception to the rule, of course.

I agree that for the most part hating doesn't help anyone and it makes the person doing it look like a douche. I usually won't say anything if I can't find something good to say, or I'll give specific examples and hope the guy listens.

**bumpyjonas** · 08-26-2012, 11:42 AM

Working in the corporate world for several years the best advice I have ever across was the following "your supporters and family will make you happy but your critics make you better."

Criticism and feedback is a gift when given just say thank you.

**M!TCH** · 08-26-2012, 11:46 AM

I think another issue is that there is such a big disconnect when people are talking on a forum. I've listened to mixes and gave feedback and after rereading them I can see how I might come across harsh not because I am telling them their mix sucked, but because I am usually pretty blunt. Thanks for posting this Sigma, I'll definitely keep it in mind the next time I respond to a mix and try and make it more constructive and detailed than I have been as of late.

**Sigma** · 08-27-2012, 06:29 PM

Originally Posted by DJ Elroy

Just for the sake of argument, I think sometimes the only way to thin the over-populated herd of the DJ pool is a little hard talk.

I 100% agree, but the real difference between criticism and hating is the motivation behind giving the feedback.

I'm certainly not saying that you can never be overwhelmingly negative towards another DJ - sometimes that's the only thing you can do if you're being honest. I'm just saying that if you do, make sure you're doing it for a good reason.

Even in the case of that Bateman mix, I would argue that he was largely the target of the "angry mob with torches", lol. I read that thread and many of the comments were people just jumping on the bandwagon and I would bet that some people left comments without even listening to the mix.

Originally Posted by Manu

I'm wondering where the thin line is when it's actually about someone who genuinely can't mix instant coffee and sugar. I have seen a few who are a living testimony which proves that money does not buy skills, or an actual taste for music.

The thin line is in your motivation for responding. For example: -

Hating - You may not even listen to the mix, or you may just listen to a tiny bit of it. You may comment based on the person's equipment. You may comment because you don't like the person based on other posts on here. You may comment because you argue with them a lot. You may listen to the mix and think it's OK, but say it's shit anyway for one or more of the reasons I've just given. I don't think this does either party any good. The criticism is dishonest, which is what makes it hating. Other people see you doing it and it undermines your opinion overall, even if you do potentially have a lot to offer.

Negative, non-constructive criticism - At least here, you're being honest for the right reasons, but you're not giving the DJ much to work with.

Negative, constructive criticism - Even though you might beat the person's mix down, you give them a few pointers in what you think they need to do to improve. I think this is the best way to do it.

Obviously, when I say "you" here, I mean "any DJF member", not you personally.

**The Blackest** · 08-28-2012, 07:15 AM

Originally Posted by DJ Elroy

Just for the sake of argument, I think sometimes the only way to thin the over-populated herd of the DJ pool is a little hard talk. Is it hating if it's true? Sure, there are people that will talk trash because they're jealous, but if a DJ is so arrogant and delusional that he thinks his stuff don't stink and attacks people that are leaving constructive criticism, then it may be time to step it up and call him out. "Hating" could be any nonconstructive feedback, but I'd say sometimes it may be socially acceptable (and necessary). A certain "2001 Mix" comes to mind.

THIS!! I've been called a hater because I told someone that they should practice mixing before they play out again.

Personally, I feel the whole "DJ" scene is now a joke. You got the celebs taking a crack at this and getting paid $10k+ and insta-djs pressing sync while reading waves like its a video game and demanding higher pay than established djs. And you get called a hater for calling them out. What?

Sorry, I'll get off of my box now...