Wolfgang Gartner on the "EDM Apocalypse"

[Sigma]

To be perfectly honest, and I hate to sound negative, cynical or condescending in any way but that’s probably how this will come off, I’ve been really bummed with most of the new music that’s been making waves in 2013. I feel like the “big” sound in dance music right now is just this mashup of every single subgenre possible, to try and appeal to the most people possible, with these cheesy played-out trance pads and vocal hooks, it all sounds exactly the same and it’s really bad for the most part, and the scariest thing is that people are reacting to this stuff, crowds at festivals and clubs are wanting more of it. A few of us have deemed it the EDM Apocolypse. Dance music is in a really weird place right now. I don’t know where it’s going to go. In some way I’m hoping Daft Punk single-handedly destroys this phenomenon we’re experiencing and un-brainwashes everybody into realizing that real music should have some soul and authenticity to it, and not just be a big kick drum and a trance breakdown with a cheesy one-liner and a “big drop.”
Taken from this interview: -

http://www.youredm.com/2013/04/30/wolfgang-gartner-speaks-out-about-edm-apocalypse/

Thoughts?

[Finnish_Fox]

Interesting... on one hand, isn't he making some of the tracks that he is in essence talking about (though his tracks don't come off as noise as most other electro-ish house producers)? On the other, the guy is a solid producer - not only is he a grammy nominated producer under his Wolfgang moniker but he also had loads of really solid house and deep house releases under a variety of other aliases and his (AFAIK) real name "Joey Youngman".

[Boomcie]

Interesting... on one hand, isn't he making some of the tracks that he is in essence talking about (though his tracks don't come off as noise as most other electro-ish house producers)? On the other, the guy is a solid producer - not only is he a grammy nominated producer under his Wolfgang moniker but he also had loads of really solid house and deep house releases under a variety of other aliases and his (AFAIK) real name "Joey Youngman".

I was thinking the same thing.

[ezelkow1]

another +1 to that

He's rode the wave just like the rest of em

I think many people have been having this same thought and wish for years now though. After a year of 'cheesy line', 'drop', 'crowd cheer', it got real old a long time ago. I think it only kept going so long just because it started at the same time as a large new wave of listeners also came into it. Since many also came in with the dubstep wave the artists decided to start combining the ideas together into the giant mish mash he speaks of in order to gain the largest crowd possible.

Luckily that whole trend should start dying off in a year or so and the majority will move on to whatever is new then, and everything can go back to the way it was, or at least with a bit more experimentation and definition then everything sounding the same

[alazydj]

I've always liked Gartner's style, and the statement he's given is very chilling and true. Praying that Daft Punk can single-handedly change the scene is crazy...but hopefully it will be a gateway for some of these kids to check out other influences of 'edm'.

[JackStalk]

Interesting... on one hand, isn't he making some of the tracks that he is in essence talking about (though his tracks don't come off as noise as most other electro-ish house producers)? On the other, the guy is a solid producer - not only is he a grammy nominated producer under his Wolfgang moniker but he also had loads of really solid house and deep house releases under a variety of other aliases and his (AFAIK) real name "Joey Youngman".

His electro tracks still stand out pretty well against the rest of the scene. Some of his tracks have gotten really experimental in the last year or two. I think he's centering on the big commercial "progressive house" vibe. Even most of the big "trance" tracks now are 128-132bpm and have an electro drop in them.

[contra]

I agree with him 100%. Does anyone remember when we used to make fun of this EXACT kind of music and it was referred to as 'cheese'? Well, apparently people like cheese. The sad part is there's only a handful of people in the scene old enough to still remember those days.

[Lazy O]

He needs to start making some funky jazzy jackin house again!!!! :love::slayer:

Been saying it since he turned into Wolfgang........Come back Joey!!!!!! :cry::argh::slayerr::dance:

[pete]

While a lot of the dance music that is becoming popular is annoying and not to my taste, it remains trival popular music, and should be treated as such.
There are always tracks around that I dislike, and their triviality will not affect the dance music scene, that has seen trends come and go out of favour with the masses.
Much the same as I find stuff of the pop/dance genre that I enjoy, even if it is the type of stuff I would have turned my nose up to a few years ago. e.g. Cinnamon Chasers, Michael Casette.

Daft Punk will not save the world, I didn't even bother with their last album. Still they will release nice stuff.

Digging remains the same ... ignoring trends to find stuff you like of all genres of all eras is the job of a DJ who plays for the music. What happens outisde of this is insignificant.

[Boomcie]

He needs to start making some funky jazzy jackin house again!!!! :love::slayer:

Been saying it since he turned into Wolfgang........Come back Joey!!!!!! :cry::argh::slayerr::dance:

Word!!

[Sigma]

Word!!
.....to your moms. I came to drop bombs. I got more rhymes than the Bible got psalms.

[thehadgi]

.....to your moms. I came to drop bombs. I got more rhymes than the Bible got psalms.

stop jumpin around sigma

:lol:

i also second that he's got some cheese tracks, at least under the woflgang moniker. also, i mean daft punk is good and all, but i still don't hail them as some godsend of amazing incredible music. it's good, and they have a lot of influence, but... not like some people make it out to be.

and didn't wolfgang call out some people in a similiar manner not too long ago? better be careful, we might have a new dj sneak on our hands :lol:

[Rek_Aviles]

stop jumpin around sigma

:lol:


That song will never die!!! :slayer:

[Finnish_Fox]

His electro tracks still stand out pretty well against the rest of the scene. Some of his tracks have gotten really experimental in the last year or two. I think he's centering on the big commercial "progressive house" vibe. Even most of the big "trance" tracks now are 128-132bpm and have an electro drop in them.

I can see the (slight) difference as I noted in my original post, however you can't argue that he isn't riding the coattails, even if he happens to be putting out a better product than the rest.

Trance isn't trance anymore. Its more like Electrodubstance.

[Sigma]

That song will never die!!! :slayer:
For a bonus point, who is this?.....

http://i.imgur.com/ASxapfI.jpg

[Finnish_Fox]

He needs to start making some funky jazzy jackin house again!!!! :love::slayer:

Been saying it since he turned into Wolfgang........Come back Joey!!!!!! :cry::argh::slayerr::dance:

^ this. Was contemplating tweeting at him to ask if he's ever going to put out some good house again. :P

[RDRCK]

^ this. Was contemplating tweeting at him to ask if he's ever going to put out some good house again. :P

Meh, Joey Youngman's stuff is snooze worthy, as is his stuff as WG :shrug:

[thehadgi]

Electrodubstance.

I think we finally have a winner here ladies and gents. Way better than the 'trouse' label being used now :applause:

[Finnish_Fox]

Meh, Joey Youngman's stuff is snooze worthy, as is his stuff as WG :shrug:

I enjoyed some of his tracks under "The Girth" and there was of course all of his Mario Fabriani stuff.

[Finnish_Fox]

Plus, you can at least admit its "good house" even if the tracks are mediocre themselves. :lol:

[Boomcie]

For a bonus point, who is this?.....



The Mac Daddy and Daddy Mac

[KLH]

I interpret his rant to mean that the commercial formula for EDM has now been determined. As such, people are cranking out tracks based on the formula ad nauseum in hopes of being the next hit. If memory serves, the same thing happened to many popular music styles (Eurodance immediately comes to mind).

Music should be about creativity and expression. It should push bounds and defy convention. The concept of a "formula" shouldn't exist for any genre or subgenre. On that I think we all agree.

The problem is greed for money.

-KLH

[Rek_Aviles]

The Mac Daddy and Daddy Mac

is it? Ha.. I had no clue who they were.

[Sigma]

The concept of a "formula" shouldn't exist for any genre or subgenre. On that I think we all agree.
But isn't a genre essentially comprised of music made to a particular formula?

[JackStalk]

.....to your moms. I came to drop bombs. I got more rhymes than the Bible got psalms.

Only 151 rhymes? What a joke!


I can see the (slight) difference as I noted in my original post, however you can't argue that he isn't riding the coattails, even if he happens to be putting out a better product than the rest.

Trance isn't trance anymore. Its more like Electrodubstance.

Yeah, he still has to play to the crowd, just like Armin dropping "Kick Out The Epic" and other electro tracks. I am curious to see where the scene goes though, it'll probably mesh into the mainstream and be like rock music. I see the indie rock/alternative scene looking up lately since Foster The People and Mumford&Sons :)

[alazydj]

Only 151 rhymes? What a joke!


It's still MORE rhymes than psalms...

[KLH]

But isn't a genre essentially comprised of music made to a particular formula?
Not usually. While there are similar elements and motifs within a genre, but in EDM the phrasing, samples, instruments, and effects are so similar they might be templated.

-KLH

[DJ Nada]

Digging remains the same ... ignoring trends to find stuff you like of all genres of all eras is the job of a DJ who plays for the music. What happens outisde of this is insignificant.

This right here. Far too many DJ's have neglected digging, and have gone with playing the top 20-30 songs of whatever genre they spin. That's part of what feeds the bullcrap commercial pop scene.

[thehadgi]

Not usually. While there are similar elements and motifs within a genre, but in EDM the phrasing, samples, instruments, and effects are so similar they might be templated.

-KLH

They are templated, literally. Or at least there are 'sample' packs purely made of templates, midi chord progressions, and presets.

Not saying whoever we are talking about, or who in general uses it, but at least one other poster on DJF echoed a similar 'template' view a bit ago. Makes sense after seeing these 'packs' flood the market

[Interracial Tea]

Interesting... on one hand, isn't he making some of the tracks that he is in essence talking about (though his tracks don't come off as noise as most other electro-ish house producers)? On the other, the guy is a solid producer - not only is he a grammy nominated producer under his Wolfgang moniker but he also had loads of really solid house and deep house releases under a variety of other aliases and his (AFAIK) real name "Joey Youngman".


I was thinking the same thing.

If you follow him on Twitter, you quickly realize that he does shit just for the money (just like deadmau5) and that it pays off. He lives in the hills of Hollywood, drives around in a Maserati, and has a waterfall installed in his house.


He needs to start making some funky jazzy jackin house again!!!! :love::slayer:

Been saying it since he turned into Wolfgang........Come back Joey!!!!!! :cry::argh::slayerr::dance:
http://whiteraverrafting.com/camp-bisco-12-artist-spotlight-wolfgang-gartner-interview/2013/04/29/

There are a ton of reasons I don’t make underground house anymore. First and foremost, it’s underground. I got tired of living beneath the surface. I wanted my music to get more exposure and reach more people, I felt it deserved it, and there was no way to do that without changing the music. I still love all that stuff. I did a “90′s house mix” recently and gave it out to the blogs for people to download and I’ll probably do another one again soon. I would probably enjoy making it still, but the bottom line is I just don’t have time. Underground house is still underground, it doesn’t generate the type of exposure or music sales these days to base a career on. So what that equates to is that it would be a hobby – something I would be doing strictly for fun. And at the moment I’m so overwhelmed with everything in the world of Wolfgang Gartner – touring, keeping up with my release schedule, myriad daily issues and tasks of coordinating with my team to make sure things run smoothly and we make the right decisions, everything that my career has become over the past 5 years, that I don’t have time for a hobby. I guess that’s what it really comes down to. I still love it, but underground house is a hobby, and I’m too busy for a hobby right now. Maybe one day I’ll take a step back and start playing around with it again.

[djTRiST]

In several ways I think he is right, but I dont see it as a bad thing at all. Things always go in cycles and I remember when big beat was huge in the states, it seemed like fatboy slim and chemical bros were gonna take over and then it just kinda imploded on itself and disappeared from the radar. Now its the same, but instead of 'Electronica' it is 'EDM' and there is greater mass appeal behind it.

I was disappointed when Joey went electro-wolfgang, you could tell it was for the $$$ and exposure. The tracks weren't really bad, it was just that bigroom electrohouse sound everybody was into a couple years ago. Now its hard to say what the next big trend in the US will be, so much of dance music has gone top 40 or festival format for all the kids who want to 'rage'. I would be surprised to see the deep house trend blow up in america, although I hope the daft punk album causes more people to open up to a sophisticated sound, instead of cookie cutter EDM. Not a huge daft punk fan either, but they have that marketing and influence that could make a difference.

[Finnish_Fox]

Only 151 rhymes? What a joke!



Yeah, he still has to play to the crowd, just like Armin dropping "Kick Out The Epic" and other electro tracks. I am curious to see where the scene goes though, it'll probably mesh into the mainstream and be like rock music. I see the indie rock/alternative scene looking up lately since Foster The People and Mumford&Sons :)

The house crowd that listened to his old stuff, under other names hasn't gone anywhere. :)

[Maikky]

Didn't he make a song with Will.I.Am ?

[Andrew1207]

If you follow him on Twitter, you quickly realize that he does shit just for the money (just like deadmau5) and that it pays off. He lives in the hills of Hollywood, drives around in a Maserati, and has a waterfall installed in his house.

(As much as I am sick of hearing about the current "EDM" scene from every producer in the world...)

I follow him and I don't necessarily agree with what you said here. There isn't anything wrong with having those things at all, if you can afford it and it makes you happy, why not? Sure, he produces some commercial music, but how could you possibly know he doesn't enjoy making it. While it is for the main room, he usually does make tracks that stand apart from the others with some unique chord progressions or synths, structures ("Anaconda" as a recent example in my opinion). His melodies are often creative. He's always been vocal about his dislike of generic dance music. But he also loves current rap music and says it's pretty much all he listens to, so obviously he does like commercial music, just not all of it.

[thehadgi]

(As much as I am sick of hearing about the current "EDM" scene from every producer in the world...)

:lol: Totally agree with you. This isn't going to be the best analogy, but here it goes...

They work in the 'EDM scene'. So it's their job. So here they are complaining about their job and how they don't like certain aspects of it. Well welcome to the ****ing clubs mates, I don't like everything about my job all the time either. But I don't write manifestos every couple weeks on how it's a crying shame that we are switching one of our software packages to a more complex and buggy 3rd party solution and how it's going to make doing my job harder and more annoying.

To be fair, stars can tweet anything they want, it's really more social media making a buzz about it than anything. But still... kind of tired of these 'EDM apocalypse now' doomsday predictions. People have been complaining about music scenes since the first caveman beat a stick on a rock in tempo; it's not interesting.

Unless you're a DJF'r commenting on scenes. Then it's ok to predict the rapture based on current music trends :D Totally different obviously ;)

[Finnish_Fox]

Saw this on FB:


Make great house music then change your name and produce shit commercial EDM until it's played out then condemn said shit EDM - I see what you did there!

[disparate]

This EDM stuff is some tabloid/OK Magazine shit. Producers of crap music bitching about other producers of crap music and occasionally someone not crap getting involved in the bitching (e.g. A Guy Called Gerald a while back).

Let's just ignore it and focus on good music?

[Boomcie]

For a bonus point, who is this?.....

http://i.imgur.com/ASxapfI.jpg

RIP

http://allhiphop.com/2013/05/01/chris-kelly-kriss-kross-rapper-dead-at-34/

[mr_ragz]

I totally get where he is coming from by this statement. My friends and I have been talking about 2013 and how we hope it is the year that the bubble finally pops with the whole EDM craze. I think we are in a state much like we were back in the early 2000's when the rise of the super star DJ first happened. Now we are in another second (some may argue third) major wave of dance music scene membership as well as more producer and performer memberships. I have said it once and I will say it again, laptop/midi dj and producing consoles are the worst things that could have happened to DJ'ing and dance music in general because it makes it too cheap and easy to attain. When something becomes too cheap and easy, people get lazy. And when we tie together lazyness and opportunity to get rich, we just mediocrity and a shit ton of it.

[DJ STU-C]

thats funny, my whole reaction to people asking my music tastes is 'aynthing with soul' and i dont like much modern dance music that is kicking about these days

[Finnish_Fox]

thats funny, my whole reaction to people asking my music tastes is 'aynthing with soul' and i dont like much modern dance music that is kicking about these days

Soul doesn't mean anything to this generation. Just how hard the drop is.

[David Bowman]

I agree on the Macdonaldized aspects of EDM, though slight case of pot kettle black here. There's still plenty of good stuff if you look around long enough.

[JackStalk]

Soul doesn't mean anything to this generation. Just how hard the drop is.

If it aint got no drop it's off my laptop.

[CC Ricers]

I interpret his rant to mean that the commercial formula for EDM has now been determined. As such, people are cranking out tracks based on the formula ad nauseum in hopes of being the next hit. If memory serves, the same thing happened to many popular music styles (Eurodance immediately comes to mind).

Yeah, this. It can only explain the "crossover" sound of many big room tracks, especially with the melding of electro house, the wub-wub of dubstep, and melodic hooks.

It's a feel-good concoction of the most popular ingredients. The index fund of EDM.. appealing to the newbies, a low risk attitude, and reflects general trends.