Where are you in the DJ food chain and is it OK NOT being at the top?

[Galager]

I recently saw a posting from DJ Donnie Lewis showing pics from a recent wedding. He had 4 big TVs, expensive lighting, yadda yadda yadda. It all looked very cool and I commend him for having such a clean, cool looking set up.

I, on the other hand, will never get that big or never have that nice of a set up. It's not because of a lack of desire, having a set up like that would be fantastic, it's a realistic assessment of where I am in life. My health prevents me from taking very many gigs and my wife makes sure I don't let my ambitions run away from me.

I am NOT at the top of the DJ food chain. I am OK with that... sort of. Make no mistake, I consider myself a professional DJ. I have good gear. I just have BASIC good gear and I doubt I will ever have a big screen TV (yet alone 4) at one of my gigs. I look at these pictures as well as various postings on pricing, gear, etc. and wonder if someone like me who does this as a hobby, who has basic but nice gear could (or even SHOULD) get to the point where I have multiple people helping set up and take down as well as at least a second person during each gig? Will I, or should I, actually invest in the really high quality and diverse gear I hear discussed all the time on these forums?

I am not looking to hold hands and sing kuum-bye-ya around the campfire just so I can feel good about NOT having all the toys. I don't charge anywhere near $1000+ for an evening and never will. I am serving the clients on a much leaner budget.

I am not a Great White shark. I am not a minnow. I think I'm more like a Blue-Fin tuna in the food chain of DJs. I'm OK with that.

[Defiance]

Nothing wrong with that.

There are countless ways to position yourself into the DJ industry.

A few that come to mind for (bar/mobile/nonwedding)

Best Gear: Fancy, best presented DJ, maybe not the most technically skilled DJ but a good entertainer
Highest Skilled: Technically and Skilled DJ, experienced and able to rock dancefloors on modest rented or owned equipment.
Capitalist DJ: Built/Building a Well Known "DJ Brand" certain level of technical level, with various types of DJs under this brand. The 'big fish' DJ cost more but each DJ is recognized under the "brand."
Independent DJ: The 'middle-class' DJs, some own some rent equipment. Each as a level of specialty but to the extreme of the other categories.
The minnow DJ: Stares at itunes for the evening, in it for the quick money. Keeps his "DJ" spot because of special circumstances (knows an owner, no competition for him).

Results might vary in other areas.

[light-o-matic]

I've seen as many DJ's on these forums (and in real life) with basic setups as with fancy ones. I've actually never been to a wedding where the DJ brought multiple video screens, big truss systems, etc. I know these exist but I haven't seen them. All the weddings I've been to, the DJ had a pair of speakers, usually a sub or two, decks, mic for himself, wireless mic or two for speeches etc, and a light setup ranging from just 2-3 lights to a dozen. And yea, you need some kind of system to handle ceremonies.

So yea, if you have a small but high quality setup you should be able to compete.. not for the big jobs, but for many others.

[Blue Shoes]

I'm at the bottom of the food chain. I am the guy who played a gig at that place every week for a year and no one knows his name. I basically left the game to re-create myself towards the end of last year. Changed the name, the logo, the image and started to produce my own stuff. I'm looking at getting back into it but I'm not happy with my production yet and I can't see myself being ready to play my stuff in public for months.
I don't want to rush it. If an 18 month wait +6 months training to get into my current job taught me anything, it's that it's best to be 110% ready and then throw everything you've got at it.

I don't see a problem with NOT being at the top. A mate of mine has just announced he's quitting the biz. was never a headliner but played 5-6 sets a week all over Melbourne for about 7 years and in that time many 'it' guys have come and gone. Just do your thing and don't get too confident.

I have just realised that this is the Mobile DJ section.
In that case. you should be putting as much into it as you can to stay on top and put your competition to shame.

[Brandt Slater]

You don't need to be at the top to be a good dj. Some are happy where they're at and some grow bigger with experience. In my days (88-95), I had two 1200's, mixer, speakers and a couple flashy cheap ADJ lights and pin spots. The 1200's and the entertaining on our part is all we needed to keep the crowd going. DJ's are needed at all levels. There are people who don't want to spend thousands on a dj, and this is where the lower price guy comes in.

When I look at a dj today, I judge them on two things. Talent and set up. Talent - an entertainer/dj who knows how to work a room. Can drop a tune without clearing everyone from the dancefloor. Someone who can energize a crowd, young and old. Someone who knows their music and knows how to make it flow. Especially if it's all requests. Someone who's good on the mic. Someone who actually interacts with their guests and doesn't stand behind the dj booth all night shying away. Someone who doesn't stare at his/her computer all night long, or is too fascinated on what the lights are doing instead of paying attention to the guests. Beatmatching. My biggest pet peeve. Not saying you need to do it, but if you don't. Please don't try it unless you've practiced it. Nothing worse than listening to someone trainwreck two tracks which are not in the same count/beat and/or same key. Oh, and no scratching unless you know what you're doing. A party I was at this weekend, the dj was trying to scratch on a bunch of transitions. Yikes.:facepalm:

Set Up - Neat and clean. No dangling cables. Cables tied up securely on trusses/tri pod stands. Great attention to detail of the set up. Bringing out the gear that you can handle, and not over doing it with gear.

[iammongo]

The world needs all levels of Mobile entertainers plain and simple.

There are people on a budget that want to have "Something" for a reception just to get together and dance a little......That is the niche for the craiglist DJ.

There are couples out there that can't afford 2 grand but want a great reception and understand a Good DJ can really make the party happen.....thats where I (and most likely You) Come in.

Then you have the couples with more income that really want a blowout....They are fine with dropping 800 bucks on a photo booth, 100+ on a custom gobo with their names on it and paying extra for tons of uplighting, video screens and other effects.....Enter Donnie

We have many levels above that, bigger systems, famous MC's, larger venues ...etc etc etc.

The good thing about all of this is that there are enough weddings every year to keep all of us happy and as busy as we want to be.

If you are doing a great job in the current Niche you serve and are getting asked alot about different services i.e. uplighting, then maybe it is something you should consider for the future.

but for now have no fears, being where you are in the DJ food chain is just fine, and it's needed.

Just think, If Donnie (not picking on you Donnie, you were just mention in the OP's post) were the only Dj available in his area then alot of couples would go receptionless because they couldn't afford him, they NEED you Galager!! :lol:

[Ampedproductions]

I guess I'd be capitalist DJ. I would really love to step it up ad get to Donnie's level, but the ROI/feasibility isn't there.

I've thought about moving to an area that would allow me to do this full time, but don't have the balls I guess.

[Sween]

I consider myself "near" the top but will never get completely on top... and nor do I want to either... so I agree.

I consider myself on the "upper end" of what the "average" couple in my area would spend on a wedding. The guys above me have the ability to cater to the "above average" client... I think Nick/Event Pro when I think of the next rung up the ladder. It's EBE in my market.

The way I see the wedding DJ market in my area (and this is purely a guess based on experience):

The "Craigslist" client
-Makes up about 5% of the market.
-DJ is perhaps a guy who lost his day job and is pretty desperate to make ends meet. Or maybe a novice looking to break his cherry.
-$400 and under average price for wedding in my area

The "budget" client
-Makes up about 15% of the market.
-DJ needs to work in high volume, and with less expensive gear to get by, but still manages to turn a profit... albeit without paying taxes, insurance, etc.
-Shows up with 2 speakers in a used Civic.
-$400-600 average price for wedding in my area

The "low end average" client
-Makes up about 25% of the market.
-DJ runs a real business, pays taxes, advertises... but yet still nets the same or less as the budget guy above.
-Shows up with a full Hatchback.
-$600-800 average price for wedding in my area

The "mid end average" client
-Makes up about 30% of the market.
-DJ is good at what he does, but still uses a fairly basic setup. Has a brand but not very strong.
-Shows up in a SUV or minivan.
-$800-1200 average price for wedding in my area

The "high end average" client
-Makes up about 20% of the market.
-DJ is very good at what he does, and steps things up with additional services, upgrades, a strong brand... This is where you start to see the multi-ops come in.
-Shows up in a large SUV possibly with a trailer or a cargo van.
-$1200-1800 average price for wedding in my area

The "above average" client
-Makes up about 5% of the market.
-DJ is on another level with the best gear, best lighting, video screens, etc... Maybe he is a radio personality or is extremely talented with a rock solid brand and can command a high price because he is in high demand.
-Brings in a truck full of equipment with a full roadie crew.
-$2000+ average price for wedding in my area


There is a market for all types... but I find the most profitability in the mid to upper average market.

[robare99]

I think the top dog in my market is getting $1000. He's also doing it on the side, as he's going to school.

Other than him, the others seem to be at around $500 - $600 for pretty minimal setups. Speakers on sticks, and maybe some lights. I think one has a couple 4-plays, or sure what the other have.

I've positioned myself at $800, $500 & $250 for the different packages for this year, while I break in to the scene. I have a name for myself as the go-to sound guy, so that will help out in some ways. Rolling in with a trailer and a good setup. (5000W & full on light show) next year I'll position myself at the top. This will be a year of growing my brand.

:tup:

[Sween]

I think the top dog in my market is getting $1000. He's also doing it on the side, as he's going to school.

Other than him, the others seem to be at around $500 - $600 for pretty minimal setups. Speakers on sticks, and maybe some lights. I think one has a couple 4-plays, or sure what the other have.

I've positioned myself at $800, $500 & $250 for the different packages for this year, while I break in to the scene. I have a name for myself as the go-to sound guy, so that will help out in some ways. Rolling in with a trailer and a good setup. (5000W & full on light show) next year I'll position myself at the top. This will be a year of growing my brand.

:tup:

How does one afford to roll in with a trailer when you are charging $250?

[robare99]

$250 is a pair of speakers on sticks. No lights, no mic, no operator. A jack for an iPod. Bare bare bones. 600W Just to play some tunes for a small party, or tiny at-home weddings. Music supplied by the client, on their own iPod.

Dropped off and setup the day of, picked up the next day.

Sometimes that's all they need. No trailer, it all easily fits in the back of my truck.

[DJ Donnie Lewis]

You don't need to be at the top to be a good dj. Some are happy where they're at and some grow bigger with experience. In my days (88-95), I had two 1200's, mixer, speakers and a couple flashy cheap ADJ lights and pin spots. The 1200's and the entertaining on our part is all we needed to keep the crowd going. DJ's are needed at all levels. There are people who don't want to spend thousands on a dj, and this is where the lower price guy comes in.

When I look at a dj today, I judge them on two things. Talent and set up. Talent - an entertainer/dj who knows how to work a room. Can drop a tune without clearing everyone from the dancefloor. Someone who can energize a crowd, young and old. Someone who knows their music and knows how to make it flow. Especially if it's all requests. Someone who's good on the mic. Someone who actually interacts with their guests and doesn't stand behind the dj booth all night shying away. Someone who doesn't stare at his/her computer all night long, or is too fascinated on what the lights are doing instead of paying attention to the guests. Beatmatching. My biggest pet peeve. Not saying you need to do it, but if you don't. Please don't try it unless you've practiced it. Nothing worse than listening to someone trainwreck two tracks which are not in the same count/beat and/or same key. Oh, and no scratching unless you know what you're doing. A party I was at this weekend, the dj was trying to scratch on a bunch of transitions. Yikes.:facepalm:

Set Up - Neat and clean. No dangling cables. Cables tied up securely on trusses/tri pod stands. Great attention to detail of the set up. Bringing out the gear that you can handle, and not over doing it with gear.

This.

Its crucial to be able to play the music correctly while also providing an experience for your couples. The experience I give my clients goes far beyond the set up, which by the way is a common set up in the area (at least 7-10 companies offering set ups like mine and better). The set up is the eye candy for the grooms and some brides but the responsiveness, attention to detail and dedication I put into each wedding is why the couples as a whole have had great experiences. We are a very high energy entertainment company.

Music structures are also very important, I structure my parties from the ceremony forward using as many musical triggers as possible while mixing in a not so overbearing MC.

You absolutely do NOT need a setup that consists of 4 TVs (although I like it lol) but you do need to compete with the DJs in your market. I typically book weddings in the 1600-2800$ range with a good amount of standard 1200$ packages but to keep pace with the other companies in my market I constantly have to be creative with the setups. Over the next year you will see some pretty out there ideas that I think will help me corner the higher end markets but as Sween stated companies like Nicks Event Pro Live will always take the larger budgets and shit hes only going on his 3rd year.

We just started our 2nd year but I knew going into the buisness where I wanted to be. I have a 2 year old and another one on the way so I need it to be worth it to keep me away from my family more. I love my kid and wife more then anything and value family more then anything so to take this on I needed to go big. I have and continue to turn down 6-800$ weddings because its not worth me staying away from my family.

Take that into consideration whenever starting a company. What makes you happy? Can you afford to be in that bracket? Can you put the $$ out before starting to have a set up that would attract those clients? Can you maintain? Are you just looking to provide basic parties? There are so many variables to consider...

Basically it comes down to you and your personality. Provide what you are HAPPY with, dont overexert yourself and try to keep your clients as stress free as possible. All these factors will contribute to an amazing party. Once you overstep your own boundries you will begain to fall back but hopefully not fail completely.

To answer your question I feel I am in the same area as Sween stated but I want to be, it gives me something to drive towards... for now...

[Galager]

Donnie, to accomplish that is so little time... my hats off to you.

[DJ Donnie Lewis]

Thank You Galager! I spend about 8 months with another company and used the $ to build my setup (although my techs and sound stuff I have had for almost 15 years) then left because of all the shady deals he was making then spent just about everything we made last year on building. Still have a ways to go but we have generated a very nice buzz and just got our 3rd venue to make us their house DJ. I attribute that to the brides and how we handle our couples not primarily the setup.

[Sween]

Donnie, to accomplish that is so little time... my hats off to you.

It is... but it's not that hard to grow that fast when you put in a substantial investment. Time and Money.

I'm in my 5th year and have made leaps and bounds since just 2 years ago...

[Houdini823]

In my market the top guy is probably getting $1200-$1500.

My setup is by far the best around but still fairly new in the market, in third year. I'm in the. $650 -$1000 range but can easily position myself as one the top. I hesitate doing that since I like to pick and choose when to work. I have a full time job and don't want to be gone every weekend.

My market is dominated with bottom feeders, $300 and less. I have become the preferred DJ for 2 top venues in my area which means more gigs but I can still be selective.

As for being the top guy it takes work to get there and stay there. I don't want the headache. I love how I do it now and I turn a decent profit. As long as you're making money, it doesn't matter where you're at on the food chain. Just don't be overspending your rank.

[Ampedproductions]

You can still be the top guy, and pick and choose.

[Houdini823]

You can still be the top guy, and pick and choose.

If I become the top guy and selectively pick, I can see it from both sides. One side will say he is good and demand is up. While the other side can be "we aren't good enough for him".

If I'm the top guy I'll feel obligated to perform for my fans :)

[jazzyj]

I guess using Sween's definitions I'm a mid level DJ with low-end issues? lol Yea i'm still working that m-f 9-5. mortgage is a bitch. and there hasn't been a big boost yet enough for me to make that leap from pt dj to ft dj. it is always the goal - but we're not there yet.

We more than doubled our bookings & earnings from year 1 to year 2. Now in year 3, and Apr-July is already twice as many bookings as year 2. Revenue this year will be great if I can get the fall booked up nicely. Taxes, insurance, and advertising kill me. I'm dropping some advertising this year. Consistently, word of mouth is still the biggest push for us. We're working on deals with venues, and a wedding planner, and already have an in with a florist. So we're getting there. Did just sign a deal with the Better Business Bureau - dropping wedj.com and working with DJ Event Planner now. Love it!

[den1213]

This is a needed conversation (for me). Kinda like, sitting in a room full of DJ's discussing our business.:)

I'm reading everyone's post and taking critical notes in terms of expectation/cost etc. After examining my 3 past gigs,(which I know for sure I was underpaid), I am at a critical point of where I should fit in, in the mobile DJ business. At this point, I'm really not sure. I am hoping to get some insight with further post on this thread.

[Nick_EventPro]

So first, I want to say thanks for those people that shouted me out. I appreciate the kind words, and in a way that is encouragement for me to continue to develop.

I think it's interesting to see and hear how your view looking in at yourself compares to the perception your peers hold of you. Personally, I feel like I'm just beginning. I want so much out of this business and I feel like I have a lot more to contribute to the industry.

I also think pertaining to this topic that success and money are found at multiple levels. I know a lot of turn and burn multi ops with very average capabilities making way more money then some other high end companies. I think the goal shouldn't be about climbing the ladder so much as about rising to the best of your potential in the segment of the market you want to operate within.

[Drewbdo]

The "low end average" client
-Makes up about 25% of the market.
-DJ runs a real business, pays taxes, advertises... but yet still nets the same or less as the budget guy above.
-Shows up with a full Hatchback.
-$600-800 average price for wedding in my area

The "mid end average" client
-Makes up about 30% of the market.
-DJ is good at what he does, but still uses a fairly basic setup. Has a brand but not very strong.
-Shows up in a SUV or minivan.
-$800-1200 average price for wedding in my area


^^^ This is probably where I am. 50 miles from Atlanta in a somewhat rural county, ~100,000 county population . Entering my third year in business. Four hour wedding ranges from $500 - $900, about the same as the "big dog" hometown multi-op. Preferred DJ at one venue in my county. Not sure that I have a "brand" yet, although I am starting to get referral business from past clients. Also, the big dog sends me business, or hires me, when they are booked.

Show up in a minivan or 5x8 trailer. Basic lighting, two full, but basic, sound rigs, or one 6,000 watt rig (24-ADJ Mega Par Profiles, fog, green sky laser, mix on Technics 1200's, 2-K10's, 2-K12's, 2-KW181's). I carry insurance, pay taxes and get 1099's from venues and multi-ops, member of the Chamber of Commerce, and advertise a little. No business license, but then again, when I called about one, the lady in the business license office said, "If you work from home, and don't have a sign out front, and don't have people come to your home to do business, don't worry about it." Yeah! Saved me $150. :D


I guess using Sween's definitions I'm a mid level DJ with low-end issues? lol Yea i'm still working that m-f 9-5. mortgage is a bitch. and there hasn't been a big boost yet enough for me to make that leap from pt dj to ft dj. ....

dropping wedj.com and working with DJ Event Planner now. Love it!

Yep... still working the 9-5 too! Sole breadwinner, so I'm more cautious about taking the step to full-time. I know I could drum up more business if I was out during the day hunting, but my day job has been good to me, and I've done 3-4 employee events for them, putting me in front of 1500+ people... I'm actually at work, writing this post. :)

I'm curious why you dropped wedj.com. I have the wedj Silver, and have my insurance there, and use Gigbuilder. Good system, but not much tech support/community support.


... I think the goal shouldn't be about climbing the ladder so much as about rising to the best of your potential in the segment of the market you want to operate within.

^^^ Well said! :)

[jazzyj]

I'm curious why you dropped wedj.com. I have the wedj Silver, and have my insurance there, and use Gigbuilder. Good system, but not much tech support/community support.

Currently, I am still a gold member of WeDJ.com. I have used Gigbuilder. The overall concept of GB is good. But they don't have a lot of love for Mac users. And there are bugs that creep up when using a Mac. But I guess that works for them since most of their DJ's use PC's. I just found working through trying to create even the simplest contract on there was buggy; I had data that disappears. It's not the worst by any means, but for DJ Event Planner is much more efficient, easier, and stable. WeDJ does give better search results for their marketing end of the program. But I've been a Bronze & Free member for 2 or 3 years now, and have had no more than maybe a handful of leads.

I am sure in some markets it works. Here though - Gigmasters gives me TONS of leads every week. So I keep up with them. I'm trying to out the BBB because they convinced me they get over a 1000 inquiries a year for DJ's (the local BBB) and there are only 2 other DJ's listed.

I had planned to get my insurance through WeDJ as well - it is nice that they are kind of a one stop shop for it all. But once I decided that DJEP was better for me, I just got a quote from RV Nuccio & Associates (they work with ADJA) and it was actually lower than the WeDJ price AND I don't even have an ADJA membership.

[robare99]

It's not full time for me, but its a nice addition in income to my job. It's paying for the upgrades from the income it brings in. Everything is paid for as its bought so there's no debt to service.


:tup:

[DJ Donnie Lewis]

Best way to do it. That's the thing I'm happy most about is not having debt. But then again not having profit isn't fun either 8)

[Drewbdo]

... It's paying for the upgrades from the income it brings in. Everything is paid for as its bought so there's no debt to service.

Yeah, that makes a big difference. Same here. I don't borrow money for anything, so it's slower to build the business and buy equipment. However, if the economy goes (further) down the crapper, or if I had an unexpected injury/illness and could not work, I would not be in trouble with debt.

I don't have to sell stuff at bargain pricing because I need cash NOW. :uhoh:

Be very careful with debt. It's like fire - it can keep you warm and cook your food, or it can burn your house down... and it can go from good to very bad extremely fast.

[robare99]

True enough. I'm almost where I want to be, then after that, it's gravy. Run a positive balance, keep some aside for taxes, its all good. It won't replace my day job anytime soon, but its a nice side project, fun and like I said it pays for itself. I have a nice rig which cost some bucks, but how much is an RV? Or a boat? At least this side hobby pays for itself.



:love: