Ben Mills vs xs2man - Deep Progressive Battle

[JonAvalon]

Mix 1 (http://www.djfbattles.com/battles/xs2man-vs-Ben Mills-1.mp3)

Mix 2 (http://www.djfbattles.com/battles/xs2man-vs-Ben Mills-2.mp3)

Rules:

Strictly Vinyl (Traktor, Serato etc are cool)
No Auto Sync or grids - lets do it the good old fashioned way and use our ears
Anything with a Deep Underground feel, Prog Breaks, Prog House, Deep House, Deep Trance etc all cool,
Last track has to be mixed in by the 30 minute mark. Your mix can last up to 40 mins or more as long as the last transition is in and noticeable by the 30 minute mark.
Winner goes against the winner of the Delta V vs ChrisHynds battle (http://www.djforums.com/forums/showthread.php?22043-ChrisHynds-vs-Delta-V-Deep-Progressive-Battle)

[Hausgeist]

I listened to both. I am going to give them another listen before I vote.

Edit: First of all, it was very apparent which mix was made with dvs and which was made with records.

Mix One: Smooth mix. Overall it flowed well, and I enjoyed the tracks. The only critique I would make is a couple of times there seemed to be some slight level spikes, but I am really splitting hairs on this. If this was done purely by ear and track knowledge, then I though it was pretty darn good. If you used aids, such as bpm or pitch % display, key analysis, and key lock, then I am not as "impressed". That's not a popular stance to take these days, but I'm sorry that's just the way I feel, especially in a battle that is supposed to be showcasing an individual's skill.

Mix two: Great tracks. The flow was good as far as establishing and maintaining a consistent vibe. I was not as excited about the mix. I would have liked to hear tracks dropped sooner, especially for a short mix like this. There was quite a bit of drift, but it was fixed pretty quickly for the most part. I was not a fan of the heavy use of the delay/loop roll or whatever during the beginning bit of the first track. I liked the mix, and it would probably be something that I would listen to over again if it had more polish.

Rep to both of you. My vote goes for Mix One.

Too much rep given out. I'll have to hit you up tomorrow.

[Rad]

So, are these supposed to be judged mainly on technical skill ?

I have not listened to the mixes yet.

[ChrisHynds]

yea technical ability & set structure should be the main deciding points and also track selection

[ben mills]

thanks for listening and voting, hausgeist. +rep

[CamDaze]

This was a close one for me, but I gotta go with #2. I think #1 kept everything locked a little bit better, but number 2 had a better flow and track selection. The tie-breaker came down to the fact that there were parts in Mix #1 that I recognized from the last deep house battle, and I'd prefer to see something new in these things. All in all, good job to both of you!

[xs2man]

That's never happened to me before. Was just about to rep you for voting Cam, and I gotta spread some around first.

It's on its way...

[ben mills]

Same thing - can't send the rep right now.

[CamDaze]

Yeah, probably because I voted in your guys' last battle. It's been happening to me recently as well. No worries. My praise still stands :)

[ChrisHynds]

I will be listening to this later guys :)

[aaron altar]

Mix 1-there was some drifting in tracks with generally quick but noticeable corrections. The mix flowed ok but there were times when the mixing was more in your face than the music dictated in my opinion.

Mix 2-again there was drifting in tracks, this time not fixed as quickly or accurately as mix 1, and corrections were also noticeable. The mix flowed very well and the transitions were suited to the mix more consistently than mix 1. I also preferred the track selection of mix 2.

This one is tough to judge for me. They are very close and I'm splitting hairs when comparing them. Based on technical skill, aka beatmatching, mix 1 was the better of the 2. But I preferred the music, flow, and transition style of mix 2 more. For me the difference was the near trainwreck in mix 2 on the drop (I'm sorry I don't remember the time of it) so I voted for mix 1. If mix 2 was cleaned up a bit I would love to have an extended copy of it. Good job to both of you.

[ben mills]

Thanks for voting. Plus rep.

[DJ Difficult]

Good job again, mates! I had a really enjoyable hour in train.
Both mixes had some drifting but they was corrected pretty fast and in my opinion, it's good thing nowadays to have "errors" like them. Makes a little cap between computer helped mixing from non-helped.

#1: More cleaner than it's competitor on technical aspect and trackselection was great. Few i have myself :lol:. Good flow from start to finnish.

#2: There was couple more drifts than #1 but like i sayed, i don't mind, i kind of like it. Few pretty awsome deep grooves here whitch made my foot tap little more than on #1. But in think that few was also played little too long. That's a minus.

Tough one indeed. But this time i go for #1!

[ben mills]

Thanks for listening and voting. + rep.

[JackStalk]

Ill have to check this out later :D

[Rad]

Okay, after listening to both mixes (twice), I have decided ...... not to vote

Mix one was technically better, just some noticeble pitch bending, but all transitions were good, nice vibes, I enjoyed the end of the mix more than the start.

Mix two, using real vinyl, at one point (around 6 mins in) the crackle was almost distracting. Beatmatching and transitions were less smooth than in mix one, but I liked the flow and track selection better than mix one.

The reason I am not voting is because, as Hausgeist pointed out, we don't know if any visual aids on the computer were used for mix one.
If none were used, or say, only the very basic waveform, than I would vote for mix one, but if, say Traktors phase meter would be visible, than it is probably not a fair comparison and I would have voted for mix two.

Mix two is the one that I will be listening to again.

[Rad]

Oops,
after reading the rules that this mix should be done by ear, I voted for number one.
Most of my previous reply is now meaningless of course....

Edit : it looks like my vote did not register ? It is still at 4 for nr. 1.
It says i voted on this poll though ?

[ben mills]

So I guess this battle ended last night. I'd like to congratulate x2sman for putting up another good mix. He got me in the last battle, so I wasn’t sure how it’d turn out this time.

I was mix 1.

Just a couple of thoughts for some of the comments about Mix 1.

Yes, I did use Traktor Scratch to make this mix. I was a little surprised about the comment about the Phase Meter – simply because I have kept the phase meter turned off in Traktor since 2008. I had, more or less, forgotten that it even existed. So, there was no use of the phase meter in this battle. I actually found the phase meter more distracting than anything – and I prefer a clean and tidy display as much as possible. I keep it very minimalist.

In terms of if this was done purely by ear and knowledge of the tracks, well it’s a little bit of both. All of the mixing and beatmatching was done purely by ear. However, I can’t deny the use of waveforms. But, I don’t really feel that glancing at a waveform is any different than reading a record. With vinyl it is pretty easy to read your grooves to know when the breakdowns are coming, to see how much longer you have in the track, etc. I don’t really feel that in Traktor the waveforms really give any kind of advantage over vinyl in that regard. There is no option to read a record in Traktor – the wave form is all you have. Maybe others think differently – but I think experienced DJs with knowledge of song structure, phrase matching, etc., can read records and use wave forms with about the same level of effectiveness. Also, Traktor is very different from Serato in the “wave riding” aspect – as the wave display set up is not conducive to that in Traktor.

Anyway – thanks to all those that took the time to listen and vote. And big ups to x2sman for another great mix.

[Rad]

Congratulations.
I'm sorry I mentioned the phase meters or any other visual aid, that was purely because I had not read the rules very well.

I'm still wondering what happened to my vote though, I'm sure it said 4 for nr. 1 before and after I voted.
Happy it does not make any difference for the end result.

[xs2man]

Yes, well done Ben. A deserved victory this time round. Yours was the better mix.

I was straight vinyl. As was pointed out with the pops and crackles. The records used were all 10+ years old, so had forgotten most of the intricacies of the tunes. And they were pulled out the collection at random. I had a rough idea of their sounds, but it was really a guessing game here. Glad the comments on the mix didn't appear to reflect that though.

I really enjoyed this battle. Thanks to all who voted and commented. It was great flicking through the collection, and has inspired me to start thinking about ripping it to flac. That'll take years though. Got around 3, ,000 12's equaling somewhere around 10, 000 tracks. Will take a while, but im sure I will find a few gems in there while im at it.

Good luck in the next round ben. You'll need it as that winning mix in the other battle was excellent. Glad I wasn't against it this time.