Best speakers for home use

[launder]

just interested in what 'passive speakers' you think are the best for home use

and an amp to go with it :D

[Windows 95]

Mordaunt-Short Performance 6 Floorstanding Speakers $13,990
http://www.needledoctor.com/Mordaunt-Short-Performance-6-Floorstanding-Speakers

Rega Osiris Integrated Amplifier $9,995
http://www.needledoctor.com/Rega-Osiris-Integrated-Amplifier

Mordaunt-Short Performance 9 (powered) Subwoofer $3,995
http://www.needledoctor.com/Mordaunt-Short-Performance-9-Subwoofer

[launder]

didn't realise they'd be that much haha... i need a budget of about $1000

[Windows 95]

Klipsch - 10" (powered) Subwoofer $470
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Klipsch+-+10%22+450W+Powered+Subwoofer/9502488.p?id=1218115619909&skuId=9502488

Pioneer SP-FS52 5-1/4" floor speakers $250
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Pioneer+-+5-1/4%26%2334%3B+Floor+Speaker+(Each)/5086937.p?id=1218610014331&skuId=5086937

Yamaha RX-V373BL 5.1 A/V Home Theater Receiver $250
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Yamaha+-+500W+5.1-Ch.+A/V+Home+Theater+Receiver/4566122.p?id=1218487064779&skuId=4566122#tab=overview

[DTR]

home use

If it's for DJing then a pair of "bookshelf" speakers might be better than the floorstanders recommended above. Bookshelf speakers can be raised up to ear level (standing), floorstanders are better suited for a seated position. If it's for ****** listening then the floorstanders are better.

[DTR]

Might as well recommend what we use while I'm here... a pair of B&W 602s (http://www.amazon.com/DM602-Series-II-Bookshelf-Speakers/dp/B00001OX2X/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top) and a Nad C316BEE (http://www.amazon.co.uk/NAD-C316-BEE-Amplifier/dp/B003R5ZBAY/ref=pd_sim_sbs_ce_1) amp

[Windows 95]

If it's for DJingIf it's for DJing look for studio monitors.


JBL LSR2310SP (powered) Studio Subwoofer $399
http://www.zzounds.com/item--JBLLSR2310SP

JBL C5 Control 5 Compact Studio Monitors $338
http://www.zzounds.com/item--JBLC5

QSC GX3 Power Amplifier $299
http://www.zzounds.com/item--QSCGX3

[DTR]

If it's for DJing look for studio monitors.

Why? There's no need, imo. Our current speakers sound miles clearer than our old studio monitors.

[Windows 95]

Why?Don't know, never used them myself.
Just everybody aways recommends KRK, but he wants passive.

The OP doesn't sound like it's for DJing anyway.

I do agree that B&W are good Hi-Fi speakers.
Also:
Polk Audio
Boston Acoustics
Klipsch
JBL
Pioneer
MartinLogan
Infinity
Atlantic Technology
Mordaunt-Short
Cambridge Audio
Epos
Rega
EAR
Yamaha
Sony
Samsung

[RogueOleg]

I Use JMLab speakers at home. They have a few lines and price ranges. Made in France and sound fantastic. Most speakers above are not recommended, with the exception of B&W.


Sorry I am a bit of a sound quality snob.

Other budget brands that are good value:
PSB
Paradigm (some)
Axiom


ALWAYS stay away from anything that starts with 'B' and ends with "OSE"

[mix4fix]

Mordaunt-Short Performance 6 Floorstanding Speakers $13,990
http://www.needledoctor.com/Mordaunt-Short-Performance-6-Floorstanding-Speakers

Joseph Audio Pearl2
http://josephaudio.com/JosephAudio/Pearl2.html
Price: $28,500.00

[RogueOleg]

Nice. Price-no-object answer would still be JMLab Utopia line. I think the price is $200,000+. But the great part is JMLab makes some affordable (sub $1000) speakers that sound pretty good also.


For really high end, check out Wilson, Krell (I love their amps also), Von Schweikert ,etc.... there are many

[Windows 95]

The Infinity IRS V is the best sounding speaker I've ever heard.

The 12 Most Significant Loudspeakers of All Time
http://www.avguide.com/review/the-12-most-significant-loudspeakers-all-time-tas-205?page=1

[launder]

thanks, and yeah the speakers are for djing so bookshelf would be better

[jayhwk]

There's so much BS in home audio that you can almost ignore the entire industry. Very little engineering and a lot of marketing leads to stuff like people thinking that $1,000 power cords make a difference.

Buy a pair of well proven studio monitors like the Electro-Voice Sentry 100 and call it a day. You will be happy and your wallet will be thicker than if you walk into a Hi-Fi store.

[light-o-matic]

There's so much BS in home audio that you can almost ignore the entire industry. Very little engineering and a lot of marketing leads to stuff like people thinking that $1,000 power cords make a difference.

Buy a pair of well proven studio monitors like the Electro-Voice Sentry 100 and call it a day. You will be happy and your wallet will be thicker than if you walk into a Hi-Fi store.

I think you're taking it a bit far. Just because $1000 power cords exist on this earth, along with people who think they matter, does not mean that there is no difference between one pair of speakers and another. The Sentry's were good monitors but they weren't great hifi speakers. Also, it's irresponsible to suggest an ancient model of speaker to newbs, considering that unless they've been rebuilt in the past, they are almost certainly going to need work. At the very least the foam is going to be in poor shape on any original Sentry's that are still around.

[jayhwk]

I think you're taking it a bit far. Just because $1000 power cords exist on this earth, along with people who think they matter, does not mean that there is no difference between one pair of speakers and another. The Sentry's were good monitors but they weren't great hifi speakers. Also, it's irresponsible to suggest an ancient model of speaker to newbs, considering that unless they've been rebuilt in the past, they are almost certainly going to need work. At the very least the foam is going to be in poor shape on any original Sentry's that are still around.

I disagree on both counts -starting with a relatively flat loudspeaker with good directional characteristics for home use (fairly wide dispersion) you can end up with any type of tuning you want given the right equalization. True, you will need a sub if you have smaller studio monitors and want bone crushing new end. I have a pair of the Sentries that I use as computer monitors and a pair of Interface 1 Series IIs (same drivers but home audio oriented styling) that I use as TV speakers and couldn't be happier - and I'm picky about my loudspeakers. Furthermore, foam and even whole new drivers are still available as parts from EV - I just re-foamed the tweeters on mine for about $30 with new parts.

There is a pair of Martin Logan electrostatic speakers in one of the radio studios here (Martin Logan is in town)- some day I am going to do an A/B/X test and some quality measurements in comparison with high quality professional loudspeakers to see if they're really worth the money. There is absolutely a difference between speakers (and I won't spec a speaker I haven't listened to when designing a sound system, so I've heard quite a few different speakers in different configurations) but I just don't think the hi-fi market is based on good design and solid science - they're trying to squeeze the most money out of people who don't know better.

[RogueOleg]

I would never call Martin Logan high end speakers. They are sold in Future Shop in Canada (same as Best Buy) I think.

Try walking in to a real high-end audio shop and really listen to something driven by Krell, Mark Levinson, Audio Research or this level brands to see what music should sound like. I am not saying you have to spend that kind of money since it is unlikely in your budget, but it is quite eye opening.

My system is Sim Audio/ Bryston/ JM Lab. I think it's mid-fi. Cost just under $20k.

[jayhwk]

I would never call Martin Logan high end speakers. They are sold in Future Shop in Canada (same as Best Buy) I think.

Try walking in to a real high-end audio shop and really listen to something driven by Krell, Mark Levinson, Audio Research or this level brands to see what music should sound like. I am not saying you have to spend that kind of money since it is unlikely in your budget, but it is quite eye opening.

My system is Sim Audio/ Bryston/ JM Lab. I think it's mid-fi. Cost just under $20k.

I'm a a sound system operator and contractor studying to be an acoustical consultant, who are the guys who actually design concert halls and the sound systems that go in them. I think I have a pretty good handle on what good sound is.

The guys at the "high-end audio shops" are the same ones who believe that there's some kind of un-measurable quantity to sound that make high priced cables work. They run away at the suggestion of double blind testing or scientific measurement.

That's not to say I don't applaud new designs or an attempt to achieve high quality sound - I just think that taking an engineering based approach rather than an emotional based "audiophile" approach to the problem will produce higher quality results for much, much less money.

[RogueOleg]

Um, spoken like someone who actually never heard a good sound system in a home application. PA sound is very different than what is heard in a home environment. GO TO A SHOP and LISTEN. BRING A CD with you. THEN make an opinion, then express it.

If you cant hear the difference, consider yourself lucky and partially deaf.

[jayhwk]

Um, spoken like someone who actually never heard a good sound system in a home application. PA sound is very different than what is heard in a home environment. GO TO A SHOP and LISTEN. BRING A CD with you. THEN make an opinion, then express it.

If you cant hear the difference, consider yourself lucky and partially deaf.

So you would be willing to subject your system to a double blind test with a well engineered low cost system equalized to sound like yours (verified with scientific measurements)?

The million dollar offer to prove that high cost speaker cables are better than lamp cord is still open: http://gizmodo.com/315250/pear-cable-chickens-out-of-1000000-challenge-we-search-for-answers

I suppose you could win the Nobel Prize in physics if you discover that copper has electrical properties other than resistance, inductance, and capacitance.

[light-o-matic]

The million dollar offer to prove that high cost speaker cables are better than lamp cord is still open: http://gizmodo.com/315250/pear-cable-chickens-out-of-1000000-challenge-we-search-for-answers

I suppose you could win the Nobel Prize in physics if you discover that copper has electrical properties other than resistance, inductance, and capacitance.

Well.. I do love Randi's debunking campaigns in general. But the joke here is that his challenge to the "snake oil" Anjou brand cables is MONSTER.. a less expensive, but still snake oil brand, that is if anything just as disreputable. I would be more excited to see this double blind challenge done if the comparison cable was some simple, good quality 10AWG cable. As it stands, if the Anjou cable lost the challenge, Monster would in effect *win*, netting them major credibility which they don't deserve.

As far as this other argument that is going on here.. the argument as to whether there's any difference between one speaker and another or whether "hifi" is nothing but a huge ripoff... I am in the middle of a big work emergency and just taking a break for a min to clear my head, I wish I had more time to compose a good response to all this.. but I don't. But what I will say is, it's WAY TOO EASY to simply point to horrifically overpriced (5 digit prices etc) "high-end" hifi gear and to ridiculous snake oil products.. not just ridiculous expensive power cords, but things that are even more ridiculous than that... and to the people and the magazines that promote those items.. it is TOO EASY to point to these ridiculous examples as a means of proving that there is no diff between one hifi product and another and that it is all just a bunch of BS. The reason it's so easy is because it's not a valid argument:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking_(fallacy)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_composition

And many other flaws in that argument.

For those at least 35 years old or older, you probably can still remember a time (starting in the 1950's and peaking in the 70s) when the HIFI SYSTEM was a very important purchase, that many people spent a lot of time thinking about. They would read books, subscribe to magazines.. to learn how to choose the right system for them. Many specialty stores existed strictly to sell hifi equipment, with listening rooms so that you could play your favorite records and hear all the options. Whereas, that OTHER entertainment device, the television set.. was selected with much less thought and was often purchased in an appliance store. High school students cared about owning a CAR.. and a STEREO. Those were the two things that mattered (besides of course, clothes).

But those stereo stores are gone now.. and people buy don't really buy hifi equipment.. they buy "home theatre" systems and computer speakers, and they don't really listen to them with any seriousness before they buy them. They care more about the picture than the sound.

Many great hifi brands used to exist, which offered good quality.. actual quality stuff, not $1000 power cords. But they are mostly gone now.. or their names are owned by crappy companies that have no relationship to the originals. We have tons of low end crap and "just ok".. and we have some remaining "super high end" (some snake oil some not).. but the middle stuff, the stuff that was pretty damn good yet sold in enough volume to carry a sane pricetag.. that is very rare now. There are few people who are willing to buy it, and hardly anyplace to shop for it.

So yea, of course it is quite easy now to point at the snake oil salesmen and say that hi-fi is bullshit and that your logitech computer speakers are just great.. cause that's what you wanna believe, and the snake oil guys make it easy for ya.

[Incognito]

HiFi is all but dead, MP3 killed it........

[light-o-matic]

Considering how little money I had of my own when I was younger, I somehow managed to own some really nice hifi equipment. For example..

This Scott Stereomaster receiver... All tube of course. I dunno what I did with it.. it probably got left behind or tossed out at some point. Now it is a collectors item! Anyway it's gorgeous ain't it? Very nice sounding too....

http://audioklassiks.de/Bilder/Scott/scott_stereomaster_01.jpg

I actually went through MANY variations of system. I had Dynaco stuff, Paco, Altec... plus some stuff that wasn't so amazing.
Later on I had a Harman Kardon Citation series preamp and tuner.. again, great sound, great looking and beautifully built with plug in boards for all the functions.

My turntable was (most of this time) a Thorens TD140.

My reel to reel was originally an old Sony but that never worked right.. then when I was 13-14 I got an Astrocom-Marlux 407.. and THAT was great.. lasted me through high school.. until I got my hands on a Tandberg TD20A!

I went through several cassette decks trying to find one that didn't suck. My best one was a Tascam until I got a Tandberg!

I used to work for GLI so for a while my amplifier was GLI.. but it was actually a relabled "Spectro-Accoustics" model.. a whopping 125W/ch! Huge transformer.

My friend worked for Tandberg when they were going out of the audio business in the USA.. so I got a TON of broken gear that was supposed to end up in the dumpster. At the same time, Crazy Eddies went out of business.. so I got some Soundcraftsmen stuff. This is how I ended up with the system I had for many years:

Tandberg 3002 preamp, 3015A CD player, 3014A Cassette (THE ABSOLUTE BEST!!.. when it worked), TD20A reel to reel.. and a Soundcraftsmen tuner...
A friend gave me a Systemdek turntable (well, he lent it to me, but never asked for it back.. I still have it) and I bought a Grado cartridge.

And after a few years, finally I bit the bullet.. I had a REAL job finally.. and I finished the system off with a B&K ST-202 amplifier ($700 in 1980's $$ and worth every cent.. I still use it every day, in my home system over 20 years later), a pair of Proac Studio 1 Mk2 speakers and a Vandersteen 2W sub.

And that is what I listened to music on more or less for the next 15 years.

So yea, anyway, quality stuff.. sounds good, lasts a long time.
Super hard to find it these days.. but if you care enough you can sort out the crap from the mediocre from the good from the ridiculous, and put together something nice.

The problem with audio these days is that because of digital, and because of advanced chip technology, cheap computing power, better semiconductors etc.. It is actually pretty easy to build electronics that sound pretty good. It is still hard to build GREAT stuff, but "good enough" is MUCH EASIER to achieve than it ever was. And much cheaper. So, the average joe will be pretty happy with the average home theatre receiver that is on sale at best buy.. cause it's actually not that bad. It's not that great either.. but it's more than enough to make people happy. It even would probably make me happy under most circumstances. And most people don't really care enough to try for more than that.. because the performance/$$ at this low price level is so tempting, mediocre tho it is.

Unfortunately, the same economics hasn't really worked on speakers quite as much.

[jayhwk]

Well.. I do love Randi's debunking campaigns in general. But the joke here is that his challenge to the "snake oil" Anjou brand cables is MONSTER.. a less expensive, but still snake oil brand, that is if anything just as disreputable. I would be more excited to see this double blind challenge done if the comparison cable was some simple, good quality 10AWG cable. As it stands, if the Anjou cable lost the challenge, Monster would in effect *win*, netting them major credibility which they don't deserve.

As far as this other argument that is going on here.. the argument as to whether there's any difference between one speaker and another or whether "hifi" is nothing but a huge ripoff... I am in the middle of a big work emergency and just taking a break for a min to clear my head, I wish I had more time to compose a good response to all this.. but I don't. But what I will say is, it's WAY TOO EASY to simply point to horrifically overpriced (5 digit prices etc) "high-end" hifi gear and to ridiculous snake oil products.. not just ridiculous expensive power cords, but things that are even more ridiculous than that... and to the people and the magazines that promote those items.. it is TOO EASY to point to these ridiculous examples as a means of proving that there is no diff between one hifi product and another and that it is all just a bunch of BS. The reason it's so easy is because it's not a valid argument:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking_(fallacy)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_composition

And many other flaws in that argument.

For those at least 35 years old or older, you probably can still remember a time (starting in the 1950's and peaking in the 70s) when the HIFI SYSTEM was a very important purchase, that many people spent a lot of time thinking about. They would read books, subscribe to magazines.. to learn how to choose the right system for them. Many specialty stores existed strictly to sell hifi equipment, with listening rooms so that you could play your favorite records and hear all the options. Whereas, that OTHER entertainment device, the television set.. was selected with much less thought and was often purchased in an appliance store. High school students cared about owning a CAR.. and a STEREO. Those were the two things that mattered (besides of course, clothes).

But those stereo stores are gone now.. and people buy don't really buy hifi equipment.. they buy "home theatre" systems and computer speakers, and they don't really listen to them with any seriousness before they buy them. They care more about the picture than the sound.

Many great hifi brands used to exist, which offered good quality.. actual quality stuff, not $1000 power cords. But they are mostly gone now.. or their names are owned by crappy companies that have no relationship to the originals. We have tons of low end crap and "just ok".. and we have some remaining "super high end" (some snake oil some not).. but the middle stuff, the stuff that was pretty damn good yet sold in enough volume to carry a sane pricetag.. that is very rare now. There are few people who are willing to buy it, and hardly anyplace to shop for it.

So yea, of course it is quite easy now to point at the snake oil salesmen and say that hi-fi is bullshit and that your logitech computer speakers are just great.. cause that's what you wanna believe, and the snake oil guys make it easy for ya.

I absolutely agree with you. I am in no way arguing that there's no difference between the sound of different speakers.

All that I am trying to suggest is that the methods "audiophiles" apply to designing their sound systems are flawed, that they are not based in science or engineering, and that they are more akin to a religious philosophy than true pursuit of excellent sound.

For instance, marching into a store with a CD and turning on the first two pairs of speakers using the same source and amplifier is a worthless exercise. If they are reasonably close in quality and design, the more efficient speaker will sound better. Why? Because it will be louder. Even 2dB louder is enough for the brain to pick up as "better" but not quite be able to distinguish as "louder". There is a fascinating field of research - psychoacoustics - that studies the human perception of sound. A thorough understanding of how humans pick up sound along with scientifically rigorous testing (double blind, statistically analyzed, etc...) is absolutely required to compare two loudspeakers.

PS: Even though I know my turntable does not reproduce sound as accurately as my CD player, I still use it every time if I have the album I want to listen to. It's simply more fun to use!

[Nicadraus]

I recommend these cheap and good sounding speakers...

Wharfdale Diamond 9.1/9.2 or the newer Diamond 10.1/10.2. But I would still go for the 9 series because it sounds better than the newer models. Very easy to drive and match with various amplifiers. Whether an A/V receiver, integrated or reference amplifier it will sound good. :tup:

[Nicadraus]

@Charlie:

It's so ironic that you sway away from expensive equipment (such as Technics SL1200 and Bose) which you insist that are not worth and yet you recommend these???


Mordaunt-Short Performance 6 Floorstanding Speakers $13,990
http://www.needledoctor.com/Mordaunt-Short-Performance-6-Floorstanding-Speakers

Rega Osiris Integrated Amplifier $9,995
http://www.needledoctor.com/Rega-Osiris-Integrated-Amplifier

Mordaunt-Short Performance 9 (powered) Subwoofer $3,995
http://www.needledoctor.com/Mordaunt-Short-Performance-9-Subwoofer

You are unbelievable. What a waste...

[Windows 95]

@Charlie:

It's so ironic that you sway away from expensive equipment (such as Technics SL1200 and Bose) which you insist that are not worth and yet you recommend these???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiQmMQfiAa0