Advice on subs for DSR112

[Hobby-Dan]

Hi,

I bought 2 Yammies DSR112 (that absolutely rocks) last year... I've made my homework before buying and get for high end route and don't regret it...

but now I want to add one sub to complete the set-up... my homework steers me toward JBL PRX618 XLF, but actually here in Canada these baby would cost me around 1700$ with taxes... I found it a bit steep as if I want to add another one later (the IF is important here as the XLF could be way enough I think) I'll be in the 3500$ range... I couldn't justify it as my set-up is for my personal amusement first, backyard party 2nd, and friend classic rocks music show once or two a year (I expect ..lol) over 150-300 people usually

So... A DSR118 should be the logic choice at around 1000$ before taxes here, but I'm worried at 50hz at -3db spec... and when I look at different online suppliers (like Musician friend) and I see many used one available, I tend to think that many buyer shipped them back... now WHY? Do they perform really that way under expectations?

Now I have a look at a E-V ELX118P which is having a 42 Hz at -3db spec, available here at 800$ + tx, otherwise similar specs to the DSR... and lighter

I know that specs are to take with a grain of salt as marketing dept. is putting his nose into them but...

I've been looking here for nearly one year expecting a few reviews of these 2 models but nothing significant occured, so I ask directly... who has direct experience about those 2 subs? And what do you think of these choice... Is the EV way under the DSR? How these 2 compare to a PRX618XLF?... Also reliability is no 1 quality for me... I like Yamaha proven record for that...

Any comments welcome... (amplified subs only)

thanks

Dan

p.s. I had little experience on the p.o.s. mackie SRM1801 and found it pretty adequate for my needs... even if it don't have a very good reputation... but they seems to blow one after another so I forgot about them..

p.s.s I've builded myself a home theatre sub a few years ago with a 700w Hypex amp, Dayton titanic 12" sub, 4" flared port tuned to 21 hz.. conception with Win ISD, so I have some basic technical knowledge about subs... but this 12" isn't enough for the cranked DSR's

[djfaceatl]

With what you just said, I would definitely go the home built sub route.
However, I would not go about designing your own. You may want to check out the BFM designs. You could build 2 tuba 24s and they would be about the same size as 1 18" sub. And the output would be very comparable.
You would just have to carry around an amp

Good luck

[gdawg55]

Since you're in Canada why not look at the Yorkville LS801P. It's a rockin sub and you may only need 1 depending on your needs.

[jayhwk]

The EV ELX is ~$450 here in the US. That makes it a solid contender if you have a very low budget but I wouldn't buy one for $800.

I second Yorkville - since they're made in Canada, there shouldn't be an obscene mark up.

[disbjohn]

Since you're in Canada why not look at the Yorkville LS801P. It's a rockin sub and you may only need 1 depending on your needs.

+1 on the LS801P. a single XLF sub will not be enough for your DSR112's.

[b.ill]

+1 on the LS801P. a single XLF sub will not be enough for your DSR112's.

Yeah I agree. In fact IMO the LS801p is the only powered sub in this general price range that will keep up with your DSRs for DJ use, and you're in Yorkville Country up there so you might be able to even find one or two used.

If you're considering building your own check out B&C's website. They make high quality speakers that go all the way up to touring grade, and provide box plans for many of them. I built two of their 21s and am very happy with the results. It didn't cost a heck of a lot either.

[Hobby-Dan]

ok.. not in order;

-OMG the LS801P is such a big pig... I don't know..., it has great features and reputation, but the portability.. oufff... from what I've read here the XLF isn't very far from the yorkville (performance wise) but much more portable... the 2 are about the same price... I don't discard it for now

-The E-V ELX118 "passive" is around 500$, the amplified one is around 800$... nobody had first hand experience with it?

-I don't really want to take the homebuild route, messing with amp, crossover etc... + I'm kind of ready to buy now... not to take a few more weeks waiting for drivers, choosing/shopping for amps etc.

with 2000$ I could have 2 DSR118 or 2 ELX118.. am I wrong to think that I'll have more headroom and punch with 2 of these than with one LS801P or one XLF??

[Al Poulin]

A pair of the DSR118 subs would be a great choice (and probably one of my first choices) to go with the DSR112s. :)

You may also want to consider a pair of DXS15s if you want to spend less and get comparable performance. I just tested/reviewed the DXS12 and was impressed with its performance (in Xtended LF mode) and output given its price and size. The DXS15 is probably worth a listen. Make sure you have it in Xtended LF mode however, as this makes a noticeable difference and makes them sound more less like a bandpass sub.

The 801P is outstanding in terms of output for a single 18'' sub BUT as you have notices is freakin' huge and very heavy.

Al - Party-Time! DJ Services

[Paris McBryde]

ok.. not in order;

-OMG the LS801P is such a big pig... I don't know..., it has great features and reputation, but the portability.. oufff... from what I've read here the XLF isn't very far from the yorkville (performance wise) but much more portable... the 2 are about the same price... I don't discard it for now



1.OMG the LS801P is such a big pig- true, its heavy.
2. it has great features and reputation, but the portability..- true, not very portable, you may need a helper.
3. the XLF isn't very far from the yorkville (performance wise) - false, these 2 subs are not even close to each other performance wise. The LS801P gets so loud you will need 2 XLF to keep up with 1 LS801P. 1 XLF can not compete with 1LS801P but at lower volumes the XLF will have better sound quality.
4. the 2 are about the same price- true

[b.ill]

The only reason any of us mentioned the Yorkville LS801 was because you originally said that you were only going to purchase one sub. If you are only going to purchase one sub, it's the only one that will truly keep up with your DSR tops.

The only reason a couple of us mentioned building your own as an option was because you brought it up.

But JBL in Canada - man I dunno. Why in the world something assembled in Mexico out of mostly Chinese components would cost so much in Canada is beyond me. We are supposed to have this NAFTA thing going on after all... anyway if I lived in Canada I would boycott the whole brand if they are going to charge that much for their stuff up there. It's just not worth it.

The DSR18s... well I haven't even heard them but when I looked at their spec sheet and read that the driver has only a 3"voice coil... well that was all I needed to know. They should be fine for your back yard functions, and I wouldn't be surprised if two of them would keep up with a single 618XLF (because they aren't the loudest of subs either). But there's no way that a single sub with a driver like that would keep up with your two DSR tops run even moderately loud.

[matty1000kk]

Like most have said I think you will struggle to find one sub apart from maybe the Yorkville which will keep up with the DSR12's. They are a very loud speaker!
I Would certainly suggest giving the DSR18s a go. I have one at the moment and that seems to keep up fine with two DXR12's which are not as loud as the DSRs so maybe it would be best to purchase two if you can. Don't be put of With the specs and 3" voice coil. It certainly gets loud enough and is very punchy. I'm very happy with it :-)

[Al Poulin]

Nothing wrong with a 3'' voice coil in a sub. There is more to a speaker's performance than the size of the VC. Like the DSR118s, the Yorkville LS/NX720Ps also have 3'' voice coils and are excellent sounding and performing subs. The DSR subs are designed to work with the DSR tops so should match up decently 1/1. The LS801P is louder but is SO big and heavy, I personally would not even consider it.

Al

[Incognito]

I wouldn't get too caught up in the spec of the LS801P once you study the cabinet you understand it's true output falls well short of its marketing spec, it also doesn't sound as good as other options available on top of it weighing in at almost 140 pounds & having such large dimensions. The driver it uses is only 600 watts RMS (8 ohms, 1,200 watts program) so most of the amps power (1,500 watts) is there as headroom not actually for increased SPL, since it has a sensitivity of 102db it will only be able to deliver 129.8db max (& this is without factoring in power compression so it will fall short of this as well). What makes the LS801p seem extra loud is the bass boost technology it uses that is centered around the 50hz frequency range thus taking away from the much smoother response offered by the Yamaha DSR112, SPL alone shouldn't be the deciding factor when choosing a speaker since SPL can be gained in other ways while a compromised sound quality can not.

With all that in mind it would be better to get a pair of smaller smoother response subs that together will yield higher SPL (louder) then the LS801p plus be easier to move around by yourself then the 140 pound monster & as for price you could always buy one now & another later.

[Hobby-Dan]

b.ill
I'm with you on overpriced asian made products, sometimes prices are hard to justify.. but it's the new reality... nearly everything is outsourced now.. NAFTA is just a free duty program for north-american made products... and do you know what's more infuriating? Here we don't have the 5 year warranty on Yammies DSR like in the US... it's 1 year.

Al

I taked note of your comments, and took a second look at DXR15's specs and hesitated a bit but finally I would need 2 right on and it would cost more than the price of an LS801or an XLFso I think I'll pass, but they should be very good companion to your DXR8

Matty

Thanks for you input on the DSR118, looks like my 1rst choice now since I think I'll discard the XLF due primarly to the crossover point of 80Hz while my DSR HPF is set to 120Hz, and it's priced a bit too high
----------------------

This let me with 2 contenders the DSR118 and the LS801P... nothing is perfect in this world, I'm still a bit worried at the (no reason annotated) return rate of these at Musician Friend, but they should integrate the best (obviously) with my DSR112 as Al stated. But price-performance wise the LS801 seem to be ZE deal... everyone seem to agree on that... won't need 2 later for sure...

Like I said sometimes with my friends "Too much is just enough!", but I need to digest/accept/figure how I could handle the fact that this is a HUUUGE piece of hardware...

It's a crapshoot too, In the way that I'm more a kind of Hi-Fi type of sound guy, I don't like hip-hop/rap type and a lot of bass... I like flat eq, I want to hear the voice, the guitars etc... maybe personally I should be very satisfied with less than the LS801P...

I would have like to have a Yorkville product.. good quality, great features, awesome warranty.... they should make a powered version of the LS608, it's much more reasonably sized. That would have been my choice. http://www.yorkville.com/products.asp?type=29&cat=2&id=125

Edit : I contacted Yorkville today about a powered LS608.. they don't plan to built it, their rep steer me toward 2 LS720... 15" subs... I know Al have some


Ok it's up to me now, writing down and sharing my expectations with you guys surely help to clear/blurry/settle the things a bit... lol thanks a lot.. A few more meditation days about that and I'm going to Montreal friday to shop that, I should be set for the w-e.. I'll let you know.


Las minute Edit : there's a post about the QSC KW181... do I need to add another one to my list? How the QSC would stand in a confrontation between LS801, DSR118, and an JBL XLF?

[Al Poulin]

I really like the LS/NX720P. A close coupled corner/wall loaded pair would likely be an OK match for a pair of DSR12s at all but the highest levels. I've always liked the sound quality of the 720P and its low frequency extension when the boost is set to 45hz. :) I plan to get a second one eventually once gigs pick up. A single corner loaded one has been sufficient for most of what I do : small weddings and anniversary type gigs + old folk dances. Actually, a single pair of my RCF 310As are ideal for my old folks dance as they don't like subs AT ALL. :D

Al

[Paris McBryde]

the JBL XLF and QSC KW181 are so close in performance, for arguments sake we can just call them equal.

[Al Poulin]

b.ill
Las minute Edit : there's a post about the QSC KW181... do I need to add another one to my list? How the QSC would stand in a confrontation between LS801, DSR118, and an JBL XLF?



Neither the KW, XLF or DSR are not as loud as the 801P (I don't think any single 18'' powered sub compares to the 801P) but they all sound a little better. The QSC and XLF will have slightly more output than a single DSR but not by a whole lot. The XLF has had some thermal issues in the past. With any of these subs (except the 801P) a pair will be required to keep up with the DSR112s at full output.

AL

[Paris McBryde]

Neither the KW, XLF or DSR are not as loud as the 801P (I don't think any single 18'' powered sub compares to the 801P) but they all sound a little better. The QSC and XLF will have slightly more output than a single DSR but not by a whole lot. The XLF has had some thermal issues in the past. With any of these subs (except the 801P) a pair will be required to keep up with the DSR112s at full output.

AL

I agree

[Al Poulin]

I agree

I noticed you have a nice collection of powered tops. How would you compare the NX750P to the ZX5A? (used full range without subs) How do these compare the your K12 used stand alone? Which caninet's sound do you prefer overall?

Thanks,
Al

[Paris McBryde]

I noticed you have a nice collection of powered tops. How would you compare the NX750P to the ZX5A? (used full range without subs) How do these compare the your K12 used stand alone? Which caninet's sound do you prefer overall?

Thanks,
Al
The NX750p, ZX5A and k12 are all so different its really hard to compare then....
1.Sound quality (Full range) - The ZX5A is in a totally different league by far, It beats the NX750p k12 in every way possible. The k12 has slightly better sq in the high/mid while the NX750p is strong in low mid/bass when used in full range.
NX750p vs k12 in full range i'd pick the NX750p due to its fuller bass response.

2. spl - Again neither comes close to the zxa5. The NX750p is louder than the k12 but not by much. When used in high fq mode with sub, it would take 2 k12 or 2 NX750p to keep up with 1 zxa5 and the zxa5 would still maintain better sq at its designed limits.

3. Mixer section - The k12 has the better mixer section compared to the NX750p. The zxa5 has no mixer. The k12 mixer versatility makes it outshine most tops in this area.

4. weight - k12-zxa5-NX750p being the heaviest. The weight of the NX750p is its biggest negative issue.

5. The abuse factor - The NX750p can take serious amounts of abuse and keep kickin. I have never blown one in the 6+ yrs ive owned them. I advise all new djs to start with this speaker because of this and its 2 yr even if you fuck it up warranty.


Being that I always use a sub, the k12 is my go-to speaker for small gigs 200 and under. For venues holding 200-500 the zxa5 is king. The NX750p gets the least use of the 3 because I don't do stand alone much.

[Al Poulin]

Thank you very much for the detailed comparison. I appreciate it!

Al

[Incognito]

The LS801p has around a 3db advantage over a single KW or XLF, yet both the KW as well as the XLF go deeper then the LS801P & a pair of either will gain a 6db increase thus turning the SPL table in the favour of either the KW or the XLF. The LS801P doesn't sound as good as either the KW or the XLF, it weighs around 50 pounds more then the KW & around 56 pounds more then the XLF & is also larger in physical size then either the KW or the XLF (keep in mind your a MOBILE DJ). The average price of the LS801P is about $1,450 each while the KW could be had for $1,399 each while the XLF could be had for $1,099 each so from that stand point the LS801P is a cheaper option but the price is something you only have to deal with once while all the other advantages will continue to shine long after the sticker shock has faded away.

Size
KW,XLF < LS801P

Weight
KW,XLF < LS801P

Deeper Bass
KW,XLF > LS801P

Sound Quality
KW,XLF > LS801P

SPL (1 on 1)
KW,XLF < LS801P

SPL (2 on 1)
KW,XLF > LS801P

Price (1 on 1)
KW,XLF < LS801P

Price (2 on 1)
KW,XLF > LS801P

(keep in mind there are other options outside of the KW & XLF as well tha perform well)

Really once you fully analyse everything the only plus in favour of the LS801P is 3db which can be gained & beaten by doubling up on the smaller cabinets, so the one thing it has going for it can be achieved with the other cabinets yet the LS801P still is an over sized, over weight box that can only brag about 3db but still doesn't sound as good as the other options. There will be more gigs that you will not require the full potential of the LS801P yet you will still be stuck carrying the full size & weight of it & still not have as good a sound quality as the other options. With the other options you can scale your system to your requirements & have no worries if you get stuck at the end of a gig by yourself or having to deal with stairs.

I keep saying it, there's more to a speaker then SPL alone.

[Incognito]

(I don't think any single 18'' powered sub compares to the 801P)

AL

There are but you have to step out of the entry level

[gdawg55]

Go with the LS801P and call it a day. As far as output is concerned, they will best everything mentioned by a long shot. They can sound good with an EQ cut at 80hz to take out the boom. I have used many different subs over the years...some low end and some professional level....and the LS801P is one of my favorites for the money. No, it's not considered a professional level sub, but for their price it comes very near giving professional level performance. It sounds good and performs very well. It's size is larger than some subs listed here (helps explain the performance diff), but I find them fairly easy to move around....just tilt back and roll. The only thing I would suggest is a separate DSP unit so you can dial in the crossover points and add some PEQ for both tops and subs.

[Subzeero]

Go with the LS801P and call it a day. As far as output is concerned, they will best everything mentioned by a long shot. They can sound good with an EQ cut at 80hz to take out the boom. I have used many different subs over the years...some low end and some professional level....and the LS801P is one of my favorites for the money. No, it's not considered a professional level sub, but for their price it comes very near giving professional level performance. It sounds good and performs very well. It's size is larger than some subs listed here (helps explain the performance diff), but I find them fairly easy to move around....just tilt back and roll. The only thing I would suggest is a separate DSP unit so you can dial in the crossover points and add some PEQ for both tops and subs.

+1

I agree because I used to rent them and it is very easy to dial out the boominess to a nice tight punchy sound. They are not top Prosound subs, but they are not "entry level" either. As for the power rating of the LS801P here are the specs:

http://www.yorkville.com/products.asp?type=29&cat=2&id=382

All the ratings changed in January when the new production began using the same woofer as the LS1208. Al Poulin documented this on several websites.

Program Power (Watts) 1500 Watts (2500 Watts Peak)
Max SPL (dB) 140dB Peak (134dB Continuous)
The LS808 passive and the LS801P are 105 db1w1m

I cannot agree with the data posted above in post #13 and #22 regarding the ouput vs a JBL PRX-618XLF or KW181.....they are much more than 3db more efficient. I read a posting on Prosoundweb years ago when Douglas Allen smarted one and measured 133-134db 1w1m and that was with the old woofer in an LS800P. There was even a chart posted.

[gdawg55]

+1

I agree because I used to rent them and it is very easy to dial out the boominess to a nice tight punchy sound. They are not top Prosound subs, but they are not "entry level" either. As for the power rating of the LS801P here are the specs:

http://www.yorkville.com/products.asp?type=29&cat=2&id=382

All the ratings changed in January when the new production began using the same woofer as the LS1208. Al Poulin documented this on several websites.

Program Power (Watts) 1500 Watts (2500 Watts Peak)
Max SPL (dB) 140dB Peak (134dB Continuous)
The LS808 passive and the LS801P are 105 db1w1m

I cannot agree with the data posted above in post #13 and #22 regarding the ouput vs a JBL PRX-618XLF or KW181.....they are much more than 3db more efficient. I read a posting on Prosoundweb years ago when Douglas Allen smarted one and measured 133-134db 1w1m and that was with the old woofer in an LS800P. There was even a chart posted.

Yep!!

[Incognito]

+1

I agree because I used to rent them and it is very easy to dial out the boominess to a nice tight punchy sound. They are not top Prosound subs, but they are not "entry level" either. As for the power rating of the LS801P here are the specs:

http://www.yorkville.com/products.asp?type=29&cat=2&id=382

All the ratings changed in January when the new production began using the same woofer as the LS1208. Al Poulin documented this on several websites.

Program Power (Watts) 1500 Watts (2500 Watts Peak)
Max SPL (dB) 140dB Peak (134dB Continuous)
The LS808 passive and the LS801P are 105 db1w1m

I cannot agree with the data posted above in post #13 and #22 regarding the ouput vs a JBL PRX-618XLF or KW181.....they are much more than 3db more efficient. I read a posting on Prosoundweb years ago when Douglas Allen smarted one and measured 133-134db 1w1m and that was with the old woofer in an LS800P. There was even a chart posted.
OK, let's roll with your figures. Even at your figures it still comes out at 132.8db max before power compression or other factors anywhere from 126db to 129db there after. Again, SPL can be gain in other ways, the EQ still doesn't fix the phase issue the design presents, it still doesn't make it any smaller or easier to carry up steps......

[Subzeero]

OK, let's roll with your figures. Even at your figures it still comes out at 132.8db max before power compression or other factors anywhere from 126db to 129db there after. Again, SPL can be gain in other ways, the EQ still doesn't fix the phase issue the design presents, it still doesn't make it any smaller or easier to carry up steps......

Who said anything about carrying them up steps? I only ever rented them for use in main floor venues,or those that had elevators.
Dual VC B&C woofers do not suffer compression losses like single VC woofers. Which phase isuues are you referring to? Those due to path lengths?Please fell free to post the data that supports your calculations. i am curious to see how such data is derived.
Theoretical calculations do not equate to measurements. I will be back in town tomorrow and post measurements from my data base.

[DJ Pyro]

The NX750p, ZX5A and k12 are all so different its really hard to compare then....
1.Sound quality (Full range) - The ZX5A is in a totally different league by far, It beats the NX750p k12 in every way possible. The k12 has slightly better sq in the high/mid while the NX750p is strong in low mid/bass when used in full range.
NX750p vs k12 in full range i'd pick the NX750p due to its fuller bass response.

2. spl - Again neither comes close to the zxa5. The NX750p is louder than the k12 but not by much. When used in high fq mode with sub, it would take 2 k12 or 2 NX750p to keep up with 1 zxa5 and the zxa5 would still maintain better sq at its designed limits.

3. Mixer section - The k12 has the better mixer section compared to the NX750p. The zxa5 has no mixer. The k12 mixer versatility makes it outshine most tops in this area.

4. weight - k12-zxa5-NX750p being the heaviest. The weight of the NX750p is its biggest negative issue.

5. The abuse factor - The NX750p can take serious amounts of abuse and keep kickin. I have never blown one in the 6+ yrs ive owned them. I advise all new djs to start with this speaker because of this and its 2 yr even if you fuck it up warranty.


Being that I always use a sub, the k12 is my go-to speaker for small gigs 200 and under. For venues holding 200-500 the zxa5 is king. The NX750p gets the least use of the 3 because I don't do stand alone much.

I have to agree with him... I have the ZXa5, and used the k12. ZXa5 are a beast but that no mixer section does suck at times. I have the 90 degree version but I want to add 4 60 degree for when I need to use 4 speakers. I've used 4 of the 90 before for a dance crowd of 700 (building holds around 1100) and they did pretty good. Granted the building was a warehouse style so it echoed like crazy anyway smh.

But to the OP, just curious, what do you transport your equipment in? I used to worry about the size of equipment too but now that I have everything on wheels and I have a cargo van with a ramp I could really care less. Just wondering if you had a trailer or van by chance?

[Incognito]

Who said anything about carrying them up steps? I only ever rented them for use in main floor venues,or those that had elevators.
Dual VC B&C woofers do not suffer compression losses like single VC woofers. Which phase isuues are you referring to? Those due to path lengths?Please fell free to post the data that supports your calculations. i am curious to see how such data is derived.
Theoretical calculations do not equate to measurements. I will be back in town tomorrow and post measurements from my data base.

I wasn't referring to you in particular on carrying up steps but in general there usually comes those gigs where step are involved & you just wish you didn't have to worry about oversized subs (especially if the gig doesn't require the full potential of the sub in question). Any speaker will suffer power compression, the question is how much (thus why I left a wide margin for error). The phase issue comes up from another discussion on this forum concerning this very sub, I had made mention that it wasn't a true horn due to how short the horn path was but was told it was indeed a horn loaded sub (because the marketing sheet said so). So rather then fight it I decided to go along with that theory & if that theory is to be taken as fact then the obvious stands before you as to where the phase issue would come to be.

Post up the spec of the driver in question you refer to because Yorkville only post the vague spec for one driver of that sub but they fail to go into T/S parameters, etc. they also fail to show any charts to back up the rest of their spec so the little they give is all you can go on but luckily enough it's enough to calculate out rough figures that will only yield best case scenario without the real world db rubbing effects taken into account.

[Hobby-Dan]

I hate you guys... lol

Now I have the LS801PB on top of my list :freak: :P

[b.ill]

I hate you guys... lol

Now I have the LS801PB on top of my list :freak: :P
If you're doing functions in your back yard as Al said the Yamahas will probably be fine. But if you're doing high energy contemporary material, simply put there is no other commercial sub in this price range that will motivate hundreds of people to swarm the dance floor, jump up and down, and put their hands in the air all night long - if the number of subs is the same.

I don't own these subs. I have no skin in this comparison whatsoever. I make my living as a DJ.

[Subzeero]

Here are the measured numbers with maximum peak sound pressure level measurements of 134-135 db for the Ls800P. These do not support the calculations posted before power compression in an earlier posting and exceed 132.8 db in the real world.

Compared my DTH218b to the Ls800p

The Ls800p is the powered model of the 808.

I use a yamaha 01v96 board with a Cex5 dsp.
The Dth was feed with a QSC plx 3002.The Cex was set for 3.5dbv for full rated power as the Plx requires 3.5 dbv at 4 ohms for rated power. 900 watts 20-20k 1050 watts at 1k. I called it 1000 watts. Some may diss the Plx but I always liked it on the subs. I always used a 45hz low cut on my sub out with a 110hz high cut. 24 db l/r so I stayed with that. All eqing was shut off as to not favor any box. The ls800p's crossover was set at 150hz to not interfear with the crossover from the cex. Shape was set straight up at first.

The dth sub. Contains 2 500 watt 18 inch drivers.
128 db's with 1000 watts rms
131 with 2000 watts program
134 with 4000 watts peak
I figured I could get 128 with the amp I had with the ls800p at least keeping up. Dth was laid on its side for best coupling in the ground plain.

Ls800p 134 peak
One would think that 134 peak would be
131 program - 128 rms.....Read on.

I set the Cex at 4dbv for rated power for the ls800p as in the manual but I found this is to high. I think it is closer to 4 Db"U" Than Db"V"
What I did was run the QSC up to clip under load then run the Ls800p the same signal and turned up the input knob so that the limit light hit at the same time as the qsc's clip-limit light. This was at APROX 9 oclock on the dial. This was the same 3.5 dbv signal that was feeding the qsc.

With both boxes reaching full power at the same time I took a look at the boxes with smaart software. Both boxes now at -6 db input. Mic on the floor at 3 feet. Boxes were checked one at a time in the same location. The box not being tested was removed so not to effect the box under test by acting as a passive radiator.

Smaarted the dth first and got 18.19ms impulse time. Entered it in the delay time and stored the transfer function trace. The phase trace was a smile in the bandpass and looked good.

Got a 24.34ms delay time on the ls800p. I would guess partly from the longer port-horn length. Entered the delay time and looked at the transfer function trace and phase trace. With the longer port length the "Smile" was just slightly bigger than the dth's so not bad. The trace was the same as the dth as far as freq response with just a slight dip of about 1.5 db's at 50 hz. When I turned up the shape 1.5 dbs the freq response between the two boxes was the same. You could overlay the two.When I unhid the dth trace I noticed the Ls800p was 4db's louder than the dth sub. I did several traces at different levels and every time the ls800p out run the dth by 4 db's with it being fed 1000 watts.
I even tried a full power trace. ( As fast as possible ) and it remained the same.
With a bass drum track I could get 3 db's more out of the ls800p for short term.

Even if the dth was only getting 900 watts and was only putting out 127 at most the LS800P was hitting 131-132 with 134-135 db peaks. Sounds right on Yorkville......So in my humble testing One Ls800p was aprox 4db's louder that my 2-18 dth 218b sub being fed by a 1000 watt amp.



I would have to dump another 1000 watts into the dth to keep up. In the of course subjective listen test both subs passed and sounded great. Both myself and a friend thought the ls sounded slightly tighter.

Kindest regards
Douglas R. Allen

[Incognito]

Any supporting data??Without it this is just numbers pulled from the air that doesn't support the data given by Yorkville themselves outside of their peak ratings which can't be sustained.

A 24.34 delay is enough delay for a 24 foot horn path, well longer then that is present for the LS801p so why so much? Considering delay is for time alignment between subs & tops & with the purpose of your experiment being to measure subs why have any delay at all? If the horn path is to be taken serious & not just an oversized port then how did you calculate what to set the delay to since you have two points to take into account which makes it impossible to properly time align.Run the LS801P full tilt for a couple hours then come back & take a true measurement of it's potential. I am also still wanting to see the "new" specs of the new driver you mention the LS801P now uses as opposed to what is stated on the Yorkville site.

[Subzeero]

Any supporting data??Without it this is just numbers pulled from the air that doesn't support the data given by Yorkville themselves outside of their peak ratings which can't be sustained.

A 24.34 delay is enough delay for a 24 foot horn path, well longer then that is present for the LS801p so why so much? Considering delay is for time alignment between subs & tops & with the purpose of your experiment being to measure subs why have any delay at all? If the horn path is to be taken serious & not just an oversized port then how did you calculate what to set the delay to since you have two points to take into account which makes it impossible to properly time align.Run the LS801P full tilt for a couple hours then come back & take a true measurement of it's potential. I am also still wanting to see the "new" specs of the new driver you mention the LS801P now uses as opposed to what is stated on the Yorkville site.

It was not my experiment. If you want answers to your questions about the posting that I found from Douglas Allen, you will have to go to Prosoundweb or contact him on Harmony Central under the name Dookie Two. If the impulse time for a front loaded bass reflex Peavey DTH sub is 18.19ms, then 24.34ms minus 18.19ms is 6.15ms which takes into account a 6 ft path length, which is the path length for a Yorkville LS8xx series box.

[Incognito]

If the impulse time for a front loaded bass reflex Peavey DTH sub is 18.19ms, then 24.34ms minus 18.19ms is 6.15ms which takes into account a 6 ft path length, which is the path length for a Yorkville LS8xx series box.

Those timings sound off to me but I'm still not clear why delay a sub at all if you're not running tops as well, unless tops where being used as well then that kind of kills the point of measuring a sub.

[Hobby-Dan]

Hi guys, just a little follow up..

I finally bought a Yam DSR118... the reasonable choice (and the most compatible/portable/modular one).. I just tested it a few hours at various level and signals....

The thing is no slouch at all, as Matt says, it's a very nice sub.. it blend so naturally with my DSR112, I had some "boominess" fear as HPF is set at 120 Hz, but not at all, bass is tight and smooth. I'm very happy with my sound quality.

But you guys where about right, the sub keep up to ... about 80-85% of the DSR112 max spl, over that point it's a bit overwhelming for the 118W.... but it looks like the DSR tops with HPF on have no end... but it's still good... 60-70% would have been a deception...

I'm still very satisfied with it's performance now... 80% of DSR112 max is still pretty loud.. and I knew about what to expect because of your advice.... actually I won't be over that point very often I think... so I could live with that for a while...

Let's see what time will tell... the option of adding another one later is still open.. and apealing.. ;)

So thank you all for your kind advice.... "together we knew it all, but we need to talk" loll

[ampnation]

OP, if you're buying different branded tops and subs, do yourself a favor and buy a crossover or loudspeaker management system. I believe the dbx DriveRack PX is designed for powered systems.